What's the Best Do-Everything Paiste Ride Cymbal?

Neal Pert

Regular Poster
I've been super-impressed during my foray into Paiste cymbals and have fallen in love with the Masters line as well as some of the 602, Dark Energy, and 2002 models. I love how specific the ride cymbals are and how well voiced the various sizes within a model are.

I play all sorts of music from acoustic jazz/bebop to Replacements/Green Day style original rock to Americana, Blues, Gospel, Country-- no metal and no hip hop, though no disrespect to either genre. I'm just not playing them.

I've got a bunch of Paiste rides now, but what I'm still looking for is that one "Do Everything" ride that I can basically take on any gig. When I was playing Zildjian I thought of the 23" A Sweet Ride and the 22" K Con Medium as the two cymbals, one brighter, one darker, that you could more or less take on any gig and make them work. The 23" Sweet in particular has that big bell and nice, meaty stick sound on the body of the cymbal while still being very crashable.

I don't want too washy, too pingy, too high pitched, too dark, too trashy. I'm thinking the most "Medium" cymbal in the catalog that still sounds interesting.

So, what's that cymbal in the Paiste catalog? I was at DCP briefly on Friday and the guy who helped me suggested I look to the 2002 crashes-- especially the 22, which they didn't have in stock right then. I did get to try the 20" 2002 crash and was surprised at how nice it was.

Here's what I've tried so far. I LOVE all these models but they're not what I'm talking about:

22" Masters Dark Ride -- perfect for jazz and acoustic music. Not as much for loud music.
21" Masters Dark Dry -- too controlled and articulate for what I'm talking about.
20" Dark Crisp -- more washy than I thought, though I appreciate the additional high end compared to the other Masters.
24", 20" Big Beat -- too washy
21" Dark Energy Mark I -- not crashable enough, too articulate.

So yeah-- I think they all sound fantastic and I plan to keep most of them. But I'm still looking for that medium. What would you recommend?
 

Neilage

Junior Member
The Giant Beat Multifunction is the perfect "Do-Everything" Paiste cymbal.
As a ride, it has a sweet wash and as a crash, it is full and warm.

I also have a 602 Classic ride that is more pingy and has a clean bell.
 

dmacc_2

Gold Member
Everyone's ears and tastes are different (obviously).

For me, if I had to decide to narrow it to one, I would go with the 21" Dark Energy Mark 2 or the 22" Big Beat (though I do have a 2" piece of painters tape underneath to help control the wash.

Never played the Modern Essentials but I hear great things about them. Not sure how crashable-friendly they are.
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
IMO the thought that there is one existing ride cymbal that does it all...is flawed right from jump street.

Different rides for different situations, rather than one size fits all, sounds better on paper at least
 

Neal Pert

Regular Poster
IMO the thought that there is one existing ride cymbal that does it all...is flawed right from jump street.

Different rides for different situations, rather than one size fits all, sounds better on paper at least

Well, I just identified two of the sort of cymbals I'm looking for that are in the Zildjian catalog, so I think my thought is just fine.

There are definitely different ride cymbals for different situations-- heck, I named SIX of them. I'm just looking for a general, middle of the road, medium ride and want to see what people would choose.
 

brentcn

Platinum Member
They’re discontinued, but you could try to find a Twenty Series ride. Might be too “clean” for a bop setting though. Not much trashiness either.

It might help to think about why you don’t like, say, the 22 Dark Masters, for your punk gigs. Distorted guitars will swallow up most of the mid and low frequencies of the cymbals, so heavier, thicker cymbals are usually preferred, and have become part of the tradition of that music.

Those same mid and low frequencies are allowed to come through in quieter, non-distortion environments. And that’s where the complexity is coming from, that makes a good jazz ride sound good.

It’s not the cymbal’s fault.
 

michaelg

Member
I could do a lot with any of these 3

602 modern essentials 20 ride
Traditional 20" medium or medium/heavy ride
Masters 20/21 medium ride

Some like the classic 602 too .
 

dwsabianguy

Senior Member
My pick is the 22" Dark Energy Mark II. It's not the most crashable thing in the world, but it does crash okay (really it spanks more than it crashes), and doesn't wash out with high intensity playing, but also doesn't get overly loud, and has a really great bell on it. With some thin sticks it would work fine for combo jazz, and with 5Bs it works great for rock stuff.

Next on my list would be the 22" Modern Essentials ride.
 

wildbill

Platinum Member
I've only had a few Paiste cymbals, but I was especially fond of the 24" Giant Beat. I should have kept that one.

Had a Signature Full Ride which is about as 'medium' as it gets - take a look at all the 'mediums' in the description.
Weight, volume, sound color, frequency mix, and feel are all labeled medium:

The 'too clean' narrow spread irritated me after a while though.
 

Neal Pert

Regular Poster
They’re discontinued, but you could try to find a Twenty Series ride. Might be too “clean” for a bop setting though. Not much trashiness either.

It might help to think about why you don’t like, say, the 22 Dark Masters, for your punk gigs. Distorted guitars will swallow up most of the mid and low frequencies of the cymbals, so heavier, thicker cymbals are usually preferred, and have become part of the tradition of that music.

Those same mid and low frequencies are allowed to come through in quieter, non-distortion environments. And that’s where the complexity is coming from, that makes a good jazz ride sound good.

It’s not the cymbal’s fault.

Oh, I know exactly why I don't like the 22" Dark for the punk/alt thing-- it's just not a cymbal meant for those volumes. I use it with the more roots/Americana/pop band and it works great there. Funny thing is, I'm really OK so far with the sound of the rest of the Masters for the noisier band-- I use Dark Crashes and the 14" Dark Hats and they're just fine. I just need a ride that isn't going to completely wash out but that still can be washed out when the music calls for it. The songwriter writes a bit of everything so I have to be able to switch from folk to country to songs that sound like the Mountain Goats or the Replacements. It can be a wild ride.

I thought the 2002 Big Beats would be the solution, and I think mostly they are. I just want another 300g on the 24" ride, is all.
 

brentcn

Platinum Member
Oh, I know exactly why I don't like the 22" Dark for the punk/alt thing-- it's just not a cymbal meant for those volumes. I use it with the more roots/Americana/pop band and it works great there. Funny thing is, I'm really OK so far with the sound of the rest of the Masters for the noisier band-- I use Dark Crashes and the 14" Dark Hats and they're just fine. I just need a ride that isn't going to completely wash out but that still can be washed out when the music calls for it. The songwriter writes a bit of everything so I have to be able to switch from folk to country to songs that sound like the Mountain Goats or the Replacements. It can be a wild ride.

I thought the 2002 Big Beats would be the solution, and I think mostly they are. I just want another 300g on the 24" ride, is all.

Agreed on the hats and crashes.

Maybe a 24” Dark Crisp? I think that weighs heavier than the Big Beats.
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
IMO the thought that there is one existing ride cymbal that does it all...is flawed right from jump street.

Different rides for different situations, rather than one size fits all, sounds better on paper at least
I agree. The all-in-one cymbal has too many opposites. It cant be both bright and dry for example. I am a firm believer that multiple rides on the kit allows for more what @Neal Pert is after.
 

jdavis

Member
When I think 'middle-of-the-road' Paiste rides, the first thing that comes to mind is the basic 20" 2002 ride.

Used to have one a long time ago and it was very versatile. Good luck on your hunt! (y)
 

Neal Pert

Regular Poster
I agree. The all-in-one cymbal has too many opposites. It cant be both bright and dry for example. I am a firm believer that multiple rides on the kit allows for more what @Neal Pert is after.

OK, re-read my original message and ask yourself, "What Paiste ride would sound like/fill the same function as a 23" Sweet Ride or a 22" K Con Medium?" I've made clear a couple times here that I OWN MULTIPLE RIDES. One of the multiple rides I want to have will be something kinda middle of the road and very flexible. So maybe the question is, "If you could only have one Paiste ride to play all sorts of music, what would you choose?
 
I have only limited experience with Paiste as I only played friends' Paiste cymbals - played a few 2002s, a 602, a Signature and a 24" Giant Beat. The Giant Beat would be my favorite out of those - clear and defined but with some wash, good bell and crash sound.
 

Neal Pert

Regular Poster
Thanks, all, for your suggestions. I actually found a used 20" Masters Medium and it arrived yesterday. So far, THAT is the closest I've found to the kind of thing I'm looking for. I have to try it with the bands, but I've recorded it a bit solo with my usual rig and it's got what I need.
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
"If you could only have one Paiste ride to play all sorts of music, what would you choose?"
I wouldnt. I run 2 dedicated rides and a crash that acts as a third ride. I want dry, dark, and washy as well as bright and pingy. I cant get that in one, so it requires at least two. I have a crash that also functions as a third ride.
 
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