Sorta disappointed in what I hear out there...

oldskoolsoul

Silver Member
..It looks like several of your posts are now deleted..

Which is too bad, because i think in one of those replies he (Sanguinetti), as far as i remember, was saying something about a young child (including a very nice link) who in his opinion played just too amazing in order to be really appreciated by the mass of drummers..

I think there is a truth in that..

One of the reasons why most of the drummers are not appreciating incredible gospel-chops, difficult solo's, 'flashy' playing, etc, is because they completely have no clue about what is played there..

Someone who basically only plays a 2 and 4 backbeat all his life, can completely not relate to all those chops, weird time signatures, etc and then they say..: i wonder if this guy is able to play Mustang Sally..

I was at a Matt Garstka clinic last year, when someone in the audience asked something like..: "..but you never play something that people can actually dance to..?"

Matt Garstka clearly got annoyed a little, but about 10-15 minutes later he came back to the guy, with answering him..:

"Why would I also have to play only simple backbeats when almost the whole world of drummers is allready playing them..?"

I thought that was pretty much saying everything that needed to be said regarding the subject..
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
Also, listening since kid ONLY Jazz and Bossa drummers...no Rock, etc.
I'm curious, was this by choice or what your family listened to? I only ask because for me, my family listened to everything, so there was no way one could isolate a specific style without any outside input at some point. There was always music, and the genres were all over the map.
 

danondrums

Well-known member
I was at a Matt Garstka clinic last year, when someone in the audience asked something like..: "..but you never play something that people can actually dance to..?"

Matt Garstka clearly got annoyed a little, but about 10-15 minutes later he came back to the guy, with answering him..:
In live videos I've seen the band is bobbing along, Matt looks fluid and I have no problem bouncing along to many of their tunes. It might take a few listens through some tunes to remember where to relocate your downbeat, but that's kind of the fun isn't it? I think if you took many of his grooves that only last 4 measures (which is like all of them) and played them for 3 minutes, you'd probably dance. I only discovered him a week ago and really like his playing and I felt he creates a very noticeable pulse.

Although I think professional working drummers playing 100+ gigs/year are not the target of the original poster.
 
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oldskoolsoul

Silver Member
..this is my point. Less = More. Hold down the groove and you can get a lot of work..

I know, but if you only think along those lines, you could also ask the question..:

'Why has Usain Bolt dedicated that much time in his life to run each time 0,01 second faster, because he also could have just walked to the bakery store without getting tired.."

Meaning, there are just people on this planet who are just not interested in only playing a backbeat, but they want to find out how far they can (technically) get on the instrument and there is essentially nothing wrong with that..

If there is a guy playing all sorts of modulations, beat displacements, weird time signatures, difficult fills, etc from his basement and he likes to show that on YT, he has every right in the world for that..

If there is a guy playing only a 2 and 4 backbeat from his basement and he likes to show that on YT, he also has every right in the world for that..

If one of those guys is not playing on a level we like, then who cares, and just move on to another video..

If we think that the 'technique' guy is wasting his life because he is not playing simple 2 and 4 backbeats, then who cares, and just move on to a video with a guy that fits your own wishes better..

I mean, easy, or not..?:)
 

Alex Sanguinetti

Silver Member
Which is too bad, because i think in one of those replies he (Sanguinetti), as far as i remember, was saying something about a young child (including a very nice link) who in his opinion played just too amazing in order to be really appreciated by the mass of drummers..
Too amazing to be appreciated by the majority of drummers and ignored by many who FEAR people like him, specially if they are kids... was 8 on the video and now is 13 and is amazing!
 

Bo Eder

Platinum Member
Well what do you say to all that?

How about this, let me know when we're back talking about what I was talking about, rather than talking about me? Reading the last few responses sounds like I'm being psychoanalyzed for doing what I'm doing. My usual response to that is that I've come up with an idea and other people are mad because they didn't ;)
 

oldskoolsoul

Silver Member
..How about this, let me know when we're back talking about what I was talking about, rather than talking about me..

Then what exactly were you talking about..?

Because, as far as i understood, you made a few new friends on social media, you thought the playing of some of them was kinda crap and you decided to start a thread to share your disappointment/criticism about that..

I think most reactions are pretty much on-topic regarding reacting on that and on everything you wrote in your first post..

The only thing off-topic is the history of Alex Sanguinetti, but i am glad he shared all of that..:)
 
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Bo Eder

Platinum Member
Then what exactly were you talking about..?

Because, as far as i understood, you made a few new friends on social media, you thought the playing of some of them was kinda crap and you decided to start a thread to share your disappointment/criticism about that..

I think most reactions are pretty much on-topic regarding reacting on that and on everything you wrote in your first post..

The only thing off-topic is the history of Alex Sanguinetti, but i am glad he shared all of that..:)
That's what I was talking about. OK. Nevermind. Carry on ;)
 

beatdat

Senior Member
I'm all for fun, but you gotta cover the basics.
I take this to be the crux of the matter.

I think one issue in this day and age is the conflation of information with knowledge. You can't just cover the basics and not return to them; they have to be drilled into you through constant repetition and analysis until they become hardwired. Only then can you say that you know what you're doing.

I'm reminded of a quote by Bruce Lee, who said, "I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times".
 

Erberderber

Senior Member
I think with a topic such as this we need to acknowledge that different people have different goals. If someone wants to make slick videos with heavily EQued sound, quantisation and different camera angles (which doesn't Interest me FTR), that's their goal. There are plenty of young drummers out there that have absolutely no Interest in playing in a band, therefore making a slick entertaining video becomes a goal in itself. It also means that they get the spotlight instead of being the bod at the back hidden by the rest of the band. Imagine 2 comedians, one goes on stage and does stand up, the other makes wacky sketch videos on Youtube. Does the stand up comedian have the right to tell the sketch video maker that they're not doing comedy properly?

I think we just have to accept that drumming has become a huge spectrum with many different approaches and goals and people have their preferences of which one they want to concentrate more on. I myself prefer playing with other people and watching other drummers play with other musicians, but that's just me.
 

Rattlin' Bones

Gold Member
Bo - you're getting "analyzed" and talked about because some folks don't agree with you, question your motivations, are answering your question, and disagree with your thesis. That's all kinda what happens on the 'net.

Bo:
1. Am I being too critical?
2. I'm all for fun, but you gotta cover the basics.
3. Actual bands need good time more than they need a magician.
4. And really, you might as well accept your fate that you will play Mustang Sally, like it or not.

A few folks hit on your question. They do think you're being too critical, and they question your motivations and your position to be critical. The analysis of Bo comes from the question you posed.

The vast majority of responses are to points # 2, 3, and 4 in your thesis.

As for me - I totally agree with you. A lotta flash out there. Same when I walk into a GC. One of the videos posted on this thread was something like how a professional musician can tell if a drummer is good. One of the points in video - it may have been final point - was does drummer know where the <one> is. No matter what else they do in a measure - do they hit the <one> every time on next measure. Is there, well, a pattern. That's what a lotta dudes at GC don't do - there is no pattern. They don't come back to the <one>. They're just beating on drums as fas as they can. They may not know the basics if they can't keep time. They may not be able to sit down with a band and cover the basics. Those kinda drummer examples support your thesis, Bo.

And no - no MUSTANG SALLY for me lol. For NOLA musicians it's no SAINTS GO MARCHING IN. For a blues player it's no SWEET HOME CHICAGO. I would think for a jazz player it's no AUTUMN LEAVES but I still hear it played a lot in clubs. For me with our band - I'm tasked with covering the basics with songs other than those, thank goodness lol.

Well what do you say to all that?

How about this, let me know when we're back talking about what I was talking about, rather than talking about me? Reading the last few responses sounds like I'm being psychoanalyzed for doing what I'm doing. My usual response to that is that I've come up with an idea and other people are mad because they didn't ;)
Well what do you say to all that?

How about this, let me know when we're back talking about what I was talking about, rather than talking about me? Reading the last few responses sounds like I'm being psychoanalyzed for doing what I'm doing. My usual response to that is that I've come up with an idea and other people are mad because they didn't ;)
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
This has been a great thread-look at all the activity. It wasn't that long ago everyone was complaining it was dead around here LOL. Part of the problem is things often get off topic :rolleyes:. One particular fool, wanting info about drum lessons- having nothing to do with the thread, and will remain anonymous, often gets off topic. I think it's all good-everybody still civil. Bo bought two flame suits and didn't even need one-he can sell one to Ricky Bobby. If they are bright yellow you could use them for the Devo band-so maybe not all is lost. In reality I'm really a super great, spectacular drummer but I just post crappy videos as a test. See who will criticize all the errors and "obviously" know anything about drumming. So far only a handful-Andy, Doc, etc have mentioned it-so "I reckon" all the rest are subpar posers LOL. Maybe every post has to have an embedded video of your playing since it seems a concern. What's great about any video is you can criticize any element-the playing, the recording-what they used to play or record, it's endless the nitpicking extremes we seem to have-really I think it displays "critical thinking" skills. We have an analytical nature-why humans the only species to take "tools" to "technology". What I note is the analytical nature of everyone dissecting his initial and subsequent post-it's interesting how everyone "sees" a bit different and focus on certain things. Everybody has a different perspective-vive la différence! Everybody still friends!
 
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GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
Thats too bad, because there was actually some pretty useful information there..

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to write and share all of that..
I tend to agree OlkSkool-not exactly sure why they were removed. I didn't see any as offensive. As I pointed out people being analytical-there was no intention of being malicious-just asking "logical" questions. Course those are his logical questions-as you had yours. I have my own take on it but really it's all good. I think it brings up good stuff-why I interjected my questions-How the heck am I suppose to assess videos. I'm old enough to have been taken by some pretty good bullcrappers-much to my chagrin-so I am wary. Been looking locally and not impressed but what does that mean? Then am I being too analytical and paralyzed. I wonder if Bo has some "vent" aspect likely wondering why he listened to his friends/peers to network-sort of like how I felt after friends told me to join Facebook and I did friending old friends only to realize Holy crap they've lost their minds since I last saw them LOL. And I also agree though anyone can have a criticism what weight does it have-if you don't like or listen to metal then criticize it-doesn't seem an informed decision to carry much weight. Also can a dislike for a genre of music like jazz or rap make you critical of those musicians who play it? Biases are insidious. I discovered one of the people who joined this hunting club I was a member was also a drummer-he liked metal but apparently hadn't played in some time so I shared a Steely Dan video I was playing to and his remarks were offensive so can't repeat dissing the style of music-not my playing . I just laughed it off-see all the anger management classes really did help LOL. I remember the bass player for the orchestra quit because he was fooling around getting down on some jazz-which he was trained and freaking awesome-and the violins told him "Please stop-we don't play that kind of music!". That was his last day. True story. Lost a great bass player that day.
 
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GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
I've been sorta disappointed at home with things going on here. I was going to move to the UK but they went crazy to LOL. So I'm hoping I can bring about some "Hopeless change" right here. No it's not spam-it's networking on social media like FB now -OMG it never stops. If I sent a dollar for everyone I saw I'd be broke. At least I'm not asking for money LOL. I'll make a video with my platform for you guys/gals to criticize-I'll end it with a drum solo so it's drum related LOL. Seems a fitting end to a fine thread GOBO!!!!
 

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