Need help with some negotiation

electrodrummer

Senior Member
Apart from the resistor I see no difference. Of course you pull the zone off a dual zone tom when you make it into two mono single zones, using a y cable. As in the manual "In addition ,users can add up to four single-zone pads to their kit via the Kick and Tom inputs. Pads that were multizone initially, become single zone when their trigger input is shared."

Can you set a split Roland input into two totally independent inputs and layer multiple MIDI notes on both those inputs ? :)
 

Doraemon

Well-known member
Can you set a split Roland input into two totally independent inputs and layer multiple MIDI notes on both those inputs ? :)
If it has dual pads like TD17, you can assign different sounds and notes after decoupling them in the menu.
I’m not sure what you mean by layering midi notes, each input should have one.
A little easier on Alesis type kits, which need no special cable and setting. The good thing about Yamaha is that they openly explaining it in the manual, instead of just hoping you’ll buy a bigger kit.
 

electrodrummer

Senior Member
I’m not sure what you mean by layering midi notes, each input should have one.

Layering multiple MIDI notes on a pad. Or, indeed, in each zone of each pad. Stacking multiple sounds to output on a single strike, or changing between each sound/MIDI note on each strike.
Combine that with the total flexibility of any note on any MIDI channel on any zone of any pad....

(Playing sillies, you can stack 100 notes on any zone on a DTX900 .... that's 300 sounds on a single 3-zone pad!! Even one of my 20 year old modules can stack 5 sounds on each zone on each pad...)
 

Doraemon

Well-known member
Layering multiple MIDI notes on a pad. Or, indeed, in each zone of each pad. Stacking multiple sounds to output on a single strike, or changing between each sound/MIDI note on each strike.
Combine that with the total flexibility of any note on any MIDI channel on any zone of any pad....

(Playing sillies, you can stack 100 notes on any zone on a DTX900 .... that's 300 sounds on a single 3-zone pad!! Even one of my 20 year old modules can stack 5 sounds on each zone on each pad...)
Oh you mean midi sounds? “Midi notes” are the instrument identifying numbers / notes like C2 etc. Sound layering is probably dependent on the module, but is pretty unrelated to splitting inputs. My Alesis can use dozens of samples on one pad, but I think TD17s can only layer two. I wasn’t trying to suggest that any drum is better, was just saying that splitting a stereo input into two mono ones is technically the same thing on each.
 

electrodrummer

Senior Member
Oh you mean midi sounds? “Midi notes” are the instrument identifying numbers / notes like C2 etc. Sound layering is probably dependent on the module, but is pretty unrelated to splitting inputs. My Alesis can use dozens of samples on one pad, but I think TD17s can only layer two. I wasn’t trying to suggest that any drum is better, was just saying that splitting a stereo input into two mono ones is technically the same thing on each.

MIDI notes are mapped onto sounds. On a DTX you can map multiple MIDI notes on each zone of each trigger input. This means on a single hit you can fire off multiple MIDI notes and therefore multiple sounds. Think of it like a chord - that you either play all notes together or as an arpeggio. You can put "chords" of up to 100 notes on a DTX depending on model on each zone on each trigger input.

The DTX inputs we are discussing aren't "stereo" inputs per-se. They are two totally separate, independent, mono trigger inputs.. It's just to save real-estate on the module. Each input has all the features and functionality as mentioned above, but they simply share a physical input socket.

The difference with Yamaha and Roland as we are discussing, is the Roland is far more limited in what notes and what channels you can assign to each zone and each input. MIDI IN functions are also very limited - as an example some Roland modules will only respond to a MIDI IN note that corresponds to the MIDI note assigned to a pad - or from a limited palette of "percussion sounds"

--

usual disclaimer: I have Roland, Yamaha, Alesis, Korg, Alternate Mode, etc etc etc
 

Fritz Frigursson

Senior Member
MIDI notes are mapped onto sounds. On a DTX you can map multiple MIDI notes on each zone of each trigger input. This means on a single hit you can fire off multiple MIDI notes and therefore multiple sounds. Think of it like a chord - that you either play all notes together or as an arpeggio. You can put "chords" of up to 100 notes on a DTX depending on model on each zone on each trigger input.

The DTX inputs we are discussing aren't "stereo" inputs per-se. They are two totally separate, independent, mono trigger inputs.. It's just to save real-estate on the module. Each input has all the features and functionality as mentioned above, but they simply share a physical input socket.

The difference with Yamaha and Roland as we are discussing, is the Roland is far more limited in what notes and what channels you can assign to each zone and each input. MIDI IN functions are also very limited - as an example some Roland modules will only respond to a MIDI IN note that corresponds to the MIDI note assigned to a pad - or from a limited palette of "percussion sounds"

--

usual disclaimer: I have Roland, Yamaha, Alesis, Korg, Alternate Mode, etc etc etc
i don't think the average consumer is ever going to notice these things, the kit will either be in a landfill or in another person's house by the time the original owner finds out about midi notes
 

Fritz Frigursson

Senior Member
you've got some more options, yamaha just released their new high end line up. first impressions: yamaha finally went mesh.
 

roncadillac

Member
you've got some more options, yamaha just released their new high end line up. first impressions: yamaha finally went mesh.

?

Unless I'm missing something (or they didn't update their website) it only shows rubber and/or tcs pads... No mesh. The highest end they currently offer is the dtx900 (all tcs pads), the next one down is dtx700 (all tcs pads), and the next ones down from there are the dtx6 (tcs and/or rubber) and the dtx402 (all rubber).
 

electrodrummer

Senior Member
?

Unless I'm missing something (or they didn't update their website) it only shows rubber and/or tcs pads... No mesh. The highest end they currently offer is the dtx900 (all tcs pads), the next one down is dtx700 (all tcs pads), and the next ones down from there are the dtx6 (tcs and/or rubber) and the dtx402 (all rubber).

TCS or Remo-mesh options. The mesh pads are the ones mentioned in the DTX-PRO manual from last year - 3-cone design so no centre hotspot + positional. A throwback to the DTXtreme RHP pads from 20 years ago

More here with links:



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roncadillac

Member
TCS or Remo-mesh options. The mesh pads are the ones mentioned in the DTX-PRO manual from last year - 3-cone design so no centre hotspot + positional. A throwback to the DTXtreme RHP pads from 20 years ago

View attachment 108480

Thank you for the clarification!

Now with that said, and not to slightly derail the topic, what is with "fancy" edrums looking and weighing the same as adrums? I could care less about looks, if I wanted something that looks like adrums I'll bring adrums. If I'm choosing edrums I don't want to carry drum shells. I feel like these companies are getting a little out of hand with blurring the lines between a and e drums and in the end... Are just severely up charging for a "worst of both worlds" situation.

I've been rehearsing (both band and solo) pretty much exclusively with edrums for the last several months and I'm starting to agree with you @electrodrummer more and more on that rubber pads are the way to go. I do like my mesh snare but I can see having issues with it as it "ages" where as I feel like you can plug a rubber pad in and it will just work.
 

Doraemon

Well-known member
Thank you for the clarification!

Now with that said, and not to slightly derail the topic, what is with "fancy" edrums looking and weighing the same as adrums? I could care less about looks, if I wanted something that looks like adrums I'll bring adrums. If I'm choosing edrums I don't want to carry drum shells. I feel like these companies are getting a little out of hand with blurring the lines between a and e drums and in the end... Are just severely up charging for a "worst of both worlds" situation.

I've been rehearsing (both band and solo) pretty much exclusively with edrums for the last several months and I'm starting to agree with you @electrodrummer more and more on that rubber pads are the way to go. I do like my mesh snare but I can see having issues with it as it "ages" where as I feel like you can plug a rubber pad in and it will just work.
I think there are a lot of people who want the big look with the convenience and/or quietness of ekits. Either for live shows or for own fun, or to mimic the ergonomics of their acoustic kits. I like that the choices are getting wider.
 

roncadillac

Member
I think there are a lot of people who want the big look with the convenience and/or quietness of ekits. Either for live shows or for own fun, or to mimic the ergonomics of their acoustic kits. I like that the choices are getting wider.
Well said and I can see that. I guess I only looked at it from my typical minimalistic approach and not the "average consumer" point of view regarding the visual aspect in relation to function.
 

Essenter

Active member
Blast, I didn't think about that. Well I unfortunately may have tapped out all my helpful bits of info haha, sorry. I do wish you well though and keep us posted if you are able to find anything cool at a good price!
Aight so I've decided to sell my TD-1DMK and got TD-07DMK for 250 USD more than I sold td-1. Arrived yesterday, and so I played it only like 2 hours - anyway, I think TD-07 module just feels much better than TD-1 - I'm surprised of how much control I have over kits, also I feel like it has just better dynamics/better sound changing than TD-1. I think it just has one flaw - I can either get second crash or 3-zoned ride, can't both. Also I contacted Drumtec and they said me that toms on TD-07 are mono - thus I can't split them.
 

roncadillac

Member
Aight so I've decided to sell my TD-1DMK and got TD-07DMK for 250 USD more than I sold td-1. Arrived yesterday, and so I played it only like 2 hours - anyway, I think TD-07 module just feels much better than TD-1 - I'm surprised of how much control I have over kits, also I feel like it has just better dynamics/better sound changing than TD-1. I think it just has one flaw - I can either get second crash or 3-zoned ride, can't both. Also I contacted Drumtec and they said me that toms on TD-07 are mono - thus I can't split them.

I personally would take a 3 zone ride over a second crash any day, not only is the ride the more versatile option but 1 of those 3 zones is a crash anyway.
 

Essenter

Active member
I personally would take a 3 zone ride over a second crash any day, not only is the ride the more versatile option but 1 of those 3 zones is a crash anyway.
Heh, I personally would like to have both 3-zone ride and second crash to have '3' crashes instead of '2' . But I can't really complain in that price range anyway xD
 
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