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  #1  
Old Yesterday, 05:57 PM
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Mighty_Joker Mighty_Joker is offline
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Default Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Here's the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2b8bBk-V0bs

For the purpose of dicussion, I'll assume you've listened to the first ten minutes or so.

-----

Ok. I don't want to talk about chops per se, rather, I'm finding it difficult to fathom the concept behind this. If you concentrate, there is a pulse that seems to tie together the bouts of phrasing, but I'm really wondering what you all make of this playing. This is one of my all time favourite clips of Vinnie playing, I love it so much, but I'll be damned if I can understand a single note of it.

I've shown it to one of my drumming friends, and we are both (if I do say so myself) really rather good on the drums ourselves, but we just listened to this with open mouths, simply because we couldn't grasp what was driving this.

I know at a few points during the first ten minutes there is a groove, but then he just explodes, and we're back to this mad, intensive phrasing.

How is he doing this? Is it very loosely based around his inner groove that we hear in the first few minutes? Is it a stream of consciousness type thing based on an inner pulse? Or is it completely free form and formless?

I'm really interested to hear what you all make of it, as a conceptual approach to playing the drums solo.
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  #2  
Old Yesterday, 07:29 PM
toddbishop toddbishop is online now
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

I think there's pretty clearly a steady pulse happening through almost the whole thing. He's drawing from a very deep library of rhythmic knowledge, and he's able to do a lot of things that sound like one thing, but are really something else. And he has developed a lot of strange things out of normal stuff-- normal rudimental and fusion playing, and Gary Chaffee things. It kind of defies analysis.
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  #3  
Old Yesterday, 08:05 PM
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

It sounds like a stream of consciousness thing going on to me. Just my impression, I really can't pretend I know what's going on in Vinnie's head. There seems to be a sense of time that ties most of it together, but I wouldn't say it's completely continuous front to back Mostly I can detect it, but not always is my take. And it could be continuous, but I just can't follow it sometimes.

When it's just drums soloing, he can do whatever he wants with the time. Like I thought I heard him purposely speed it up for a few seconds to highlight a certain figure. Again, that could be my inferior time sense compared to his.

I don't really want to analyze it, in this case I'm just letting it wash all over me and enjoying it without dissecting it. I wish I could see him doing it tho.
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  #4  
Old Yesterday, 09:43 PM
cornelius cornelius is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Quote:
Originally Posted by toddbishop View Post
I think there's pretty clearly a steady pulse happening through almost the whole thing. He's drawing from a very deep library of rhythmic knowledge, and he's able to do a lot of things that sound like one thing, but are really something else. And he has developed a lot of strange things out of normal stuff-- normal rudimental and fusion playing, and Gary Chaffee things. It kind of defies analysis.
Definitely a pulse - he probably has a melody or bass line going through his head, with which he can “explore”...
The thing to keep in mind with Vinnie is, he was grasping pretty crazy stuff as a very young player - in other words, he’s working on a different playing field from most of us. Not that we can’t learn a thing or two, but like Todd said - it kind of defies analysis...
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  #5  
Old Today, 10:20 AM
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Les Ismore Les Ismore is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Great example of how people change.
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  #6  
Old Today, 11:36 AM
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Do you think the fact he's presenting in the premier educational environment means he decided to pull out a higher degree of "clever" than would normally be the case?
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  #7  
Old Today, 11:59 AM
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Mighty_Joker Mighty_Joker is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
Do you think the fact he's presenting in the premier educational environment means he decided to pull out a higher degree of "clever" than would normally be the case?
I suppose so, but if his interviews are to be believed, then no.

Regardless, any idea what this particular "clever" involves?
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Old Today, 12:15 PM
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post
Regardless, any idea what this particular "clever" involves?
Non whatsoever. There's thought & structure there for sure, but I'm guessing it's a personal improv' based on whatever was in Vinnie's head at the time. I'm not sure that examination of the foundation is likely to prove fruitful. It just "is".
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  #9  
Old Today, 06:43 PM
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8Mile 8Mile is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

I don't find it particularly difficult to follow the stream of ideas. There is a definite pulse through it all and he's taking it to crazy places, but there's a thread running through it.

Now, playing all that sh**, that's a whole other ball of wax. Good luck with that :)
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  #10  
Old Today, 07:02 PM
tracer tracer is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

I would sure like to be able to see this as well...
Any other clips like this with the video included?
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  #11  
Old Today, 07:07 PM
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Compare that vid/clinic where Vinnie is younger (I'll guess it was in the 80's) with this more recent one where he's older.

Major tuning differences resulting in a tighter sound, higher magnitude of concept.
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  #12  
Old Today, 07:32 PM
toddbishop toddbishop is online now
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

I'm definitely hearing more of the old Buddy Rich influence than I was aware of when I was really into him. I'm actually hearing a similar, very aggressive touch.
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  #13  
Old Today, 07:32 PM
toddbishop toddbishop is online now
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

I'm definitely hearing more of the old Buddy Rich influence than I was aware of when I was really into him. They have that similar, very aggressive touch.
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  #14  
Old Today, 10:21 PM
mlehnertz mlehnertz is offline
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Default Re: Let's talk about THIS Vinnie video

Knowing Vinnie's ability to play complex polyrhythms I'd assume there is a pulse through most of that solo. I can't hear it most of the time but I'm sure it's there. I say this because there's another Berklee/Zildjian clinic in Boston (which I'm assuming is from about the same era) where he talks about playing polyrhythms which derived from a question about "Keep it Greasy" and its time signature.

Vinnie loves to solo over time.
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