...I got the impression he mostly played with drummers who were musical blowhards, or he wouldn't have said these things.
Blowhards tend to play with blowhards ... that would be my guess.
The guys he played with were more likely concerned that they were loud enough, that they got to express their "creativity" lol, ...
And that's a bad thing because why? More importantly, why is okay for other musicians to express creativity and not the drummer? I've never understood this reasoning, and I think it's actually damaging to the art of drumming.
It IS our job to make everyone sound good. Why is that a bad thing?
Is there anyone in the band who's job *isn't* to make the whole sound good? Fire them immediately!
But real question here is who ever said making the band sound good was a bad thing? I've not seen that stated on this or any other thread. Not once. If you don't like the way some people play drums, that's fine. Do you think Vinnie has maturity issues when he blasts off? That's one of the things people hire him for, and no harm in practicing for that role if that's what turns you on, though for sure not on a blues gig. Time and place, and all that. Are you just talking about blues here?
If a drummer has a problem with "just" keeping time, either he hasn't gotten past the "ego" stage...and can't forget himself long enough to realize that people are counting on him to lay down the road for them...and/or he doesn't understand what role the drums play in a band.
What is this "ego" stage? You make it sound like ego is a bad thing. I happen to think that players need egos. The bigger the better. My ego would be badly bruised if I played inappropriately and stepped on others' toes or otherwise made a mess of things. I also never forget myself when playing - not when just laying it down, or tearing it all apart. Ego is a good thing if it can keep me from making a fool of myself and if it gives me the confidence to simultaneously follow the music and my muse in a way that sounds good.
The other thing about ego is this: you'll never make everyone happy with your playing, and to even try is to guarantee failure, so you might as well make yourself (and your properly-selected bandmates) happy. Think back to what made you start playing to begin with and keep that as your core principal. If sitting back in the shadows feathering the bass drum while "listening to the music" is what makes you happy, then go for it. That wouldn't make me happy and isn't what inspired me to take up drumming all those years ago. Then again, my kind of playing wouldn't make you happy, and that's cool too.
I'm sure my playing wouldn't make the Subject Guitarist happy either, but I'll lose no sleep over that, I promise. If you think my attitude toward drumming and music further sullies the reputation of our little fraternity ... well, I won't lose any sleep over that either.
The second you force things to satisfy a personal agenda....it ruins the vibe.
Maybe, maybe not. This kind of ties in with ego. I'm not exactly sure about what you mean by forcing things, but I'll assume you mean square pegs in round holes. That much we can agree on, but this reads more like, "leave your own ideas at the door." And "personal agenda" reads like a pejorative.
I definitely have a personal agenda, I admit it. In fact, I won't have it any other way. My personal agenda is to put the best drum part with the music that's what I'd want to hear as the voracious consumer of music I am. Sometimes that's laying all the way back; sometimes it's pulling out all the stops. I love watching/listening to drummers that just nail it, whatever that may be for a given piece of music. What I don't like is "phoning it in", executing rote memory exercises from the practice room as a substitute for creative inspiration, or dumbing it all down in some cynical attempt to meet some phantom expectation - possibly from some narcissistic guitar player not wanting to ever notice the drums.
The song is so not about the drums
What song is that? Some songs don't work without active and noticeable drum parts. This is such a broad statement, though I'll assume from this context that you're thinking drummers should devalue their creative role.
Drummers can't be selfish ...
Again, where did this come from? True, songs don't generally exist as vehicles for a drummer to solo over, but I don't see that that needs stating. That said, I don't believe that means drummers need to be so hyper-vigilant about withholding their DNA.
...After THAT is provided....OK then you can get creative. But you can't get creative without having that foundation...
True enough. If a drummer can only be solid OR creative, then of course: solid wins every single time.
But why is this as an either/or proposition? FWIW, I've always seen them as being on parallel developmental paths - not in series.
I vote to change the phrase from "keeping time" to "creating time". Creating great feeling time is not an easy thing to do, why do people minimalize it?
Ha ha! Why you gotta be getting all egotistical with "creating" time, when the time is already there just waiting for you to mark it?!! Just kidding (sort of).
Not that I DON'T (edit) think you're making very valid points, Larry, but this post was so rich with ideas ripped from just one cross-sectional aspect drumming, while ignoring many others, that I thought a little balance was in order. That, and I think this particular troll of a guitar player can go get bent!