Execution

Larry

"Uncle Larry"
Talking playing drums here, not killing someone

You can have a great musical idea, in a great place, but if you don't nail it right, it just doesn't work. There's a million little nuances that can go wrong. Everytime I say to myself, "OK here comes that tricky part"... I'm sunk.
Once I start thinking about what I'm trying to do, instead of feeling it when I get there, it shows in my execution. Only by having the benefit of listening to recordings, can I really know what I felt, while doing it, versus what it actually sounded like. My whole point of this thread is execution is so important to the final product. How I feel something and how it comes out are sometimes way out of sync. It's the kind of thing that you want to have enough technique to play what you want easily enough, but when it comes time to use it, you shouldn't be thinking about your execution. Can anyone relate?
 
Indeed, as soon as you start thinking, you're toast. This is about the difference between going over a lick or an idea a few dozen times and truly practicing something. Get something practiced to the point of being totally automatic and it'll be ready for human consumption.
 
I think that you get nervous when you record or perform and that's why it doesn't sound the way you want it to. At least that's what happens to me.
 
So you basically have to feel your way through a pitch-black hallway to reach the end without tripping?
 
There are a great many things that I would never attempt to play. I can hear them in my head just fine but maybe the most important thing, maybe, is to get so in touch with your body that you'll always be able to pull off whatever your body plays the best.

I never was and never will be a Billy Cobham or someone like that. I can hear what he plays but it's not in me to play like that. What's in me is to play like I play. To me that's the challenge, to find your own unique place, your own voice, on the drums.

See, nailing something just right is more than technique, I think. It's getting your own concept together, your own approach, your own special way of speaking. When its time to play a fill or a lick, to play something that punches the music up a few notches, that's the time to say "HERE I AM. THIS IS ME, MY IDEA, MY VOICE!" That's what will set you apart.

Execution is only part of it, an important part, of course, but equally important is to dig deep down into yourself, to get to be the expert on what you want to say on the drums and how to do that.

Anyway that's just what I think.
 
Larry, all I can say is ...

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To me, this is the single most important aspect of playing - even more than our practice routines (or lack), and much more important than chops, drum choice, heads, tuning, cymbals, mic'ing, sticks, choice of drum parts to play, stick heights, grip, stroke, etc.

The minute I turn up with a head full of ideas almost everything I play is a bit off. There's no flow ... it's like play, judge, play, judge, play, judge ... over and over ,and every time a "judge" comes along (usually at the end of a bar of playing) something isn't quite right. Worse, I find the malaise affects the whole band.

If I turn up just like a normal human being, whose stance seems to be somewhere between "blank canvas" and mildly curious, then things flow. I understand why Bob says that meditation helps his playing. Goodbye thoughts, hello execution. Jones put it perfectly - "as soon as you start thinking, you're toast".

I've been trying to deal with a crowded head for many years and it's always been the thing that stood between me and what I'd like to achieve on drums. How do people here banish intrusive thoughts so they can let their body do what it's been trained to do?
 
How do people here banish intrusive thoughts so they can let their body do what it's been trained to do?

That's the mental aspect of drumming that doesn't get much press. Conscious thought it would seem, is not desireable when playing music. But you have to have a certain amount of awareness. It's a real balancing act. After all, whatever's in your mind will come out your limbs. Meditation sounds more like the state of mind you want to be in while playing as opposed to analytical.
 
I have found I can only play what I feel..I have learned I can practice very hard complex stuff until I feel it. Some concepts take more time than others(minutes,hours,days weeks,months or years),...I need to have complete ownership so I can cover my mistakes if my execution should fall short. Also I'm much more focus on what other people are playing than my drum playing! Denis
 
I wish I could play the things I feel...the first time, all the time. That's exactly what I'm referring to. You feel a lick, a fill, a groove. You play it. You play all the notes in their proper places. But it doesn't sound like what you imagined. It's not smooth, and doesn't flow. The execution is to blame, right? What else could it be that went wrong? (assuming that your idea sounded smooth and flowed nicely in your mind)
 
Maybe more practice on that specific fill in the song along with the song until it feels comfortable. I agree with Polly about the block between what you want to do and what you can pull off when you're in the zone and we're all capable of being in the zone, but as you say it's easy and hard to achieve at the same time. From my experience, your blocks have everything to do with what has kept you from nailing that fill, just like me, but we are both very capable and the ease with which we could pull it off is within us.
 
I wish I could play the things I feel...the first time, all the time. That's exactly what I'm referring to. You feel a lick, a fill, a groove. You play it. You play all the notes in their proper places. But it doesn't sound like what you imagined. It's not smooth, and doesn't flow. The execution is to blame, right? What else could it be that went wrong? (assuming that your idea sounded smooth and flowed nicely in your mind)

You actually said it yourself, if the feeling is not there, even if the notes are right you're not feeling it and so your not there - if you're feeling it and it still wasn't right, you played something wrong.
 
I can relate totally.

A player's ideal is to be able to play what he is feeling in a musical moment without thinking it.

I have lately started to record myself which has been a real eye opener of the worst kind. The fills I thought were great sound clunky, the part I played I thought was clean, is messy, the stuff I thought was grooving, isn't... so I'm THINKING TOO MUCH these days, trying to close the gap between perception and reality.

I seriously underplay on my live gigs, and that seem to be fine with the people I play with, but I know better. Hopefully, things will get better.

On playing what one imagines, I suspect there is no other way than to break it down, understand the logic of it, play it slowly, play it a million times, till you are not thinking about it anymore. Then you can add your own tabasco sauce on it, at will.


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I can relate totally.

A player's ideal is to be able to play what he is feeling in a musical moment without thinking it.

I have lately started to record myself which has been a real eye opener of the worst kind. The fills I thought were great sound clunky, the part I played I thought were clean are messy, the stuff I thought was grooving, isn't... so I'm THINKING TOO MUCH these days, trying to close the gap between perception and reality.

I seriously underplay on my live gigs, and that seem to be fine with the people I play with, but I know better. Hopefully, things will get better.

On playing what one imagines, I suspect there is no other way than to break it down, understand the logic of it, play it slowly, play it a million times, till you are not thinking about it anymore. Then you can add your own tabasco sauce on it, at will.


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Great post Abe, & great thread Larry. Agree with everything said so far, but I'll put a slightly different spin on this from my perspective. Execution is my saviour! I've always taken my miniscule repertoire then delivered it with dynamism & panache. This ability to place & execute parts well has always masked my lack of rounded skills. This being my return to drumming after so many years away, I'm not there yet, but I'm well on the way. Once the execution of my drum parts is as near perfect as I can make them, then I'll concentrate on expanding the repertoire. Until then, it's execution & performance all the way.
 
I wish I could play the things I feel...the first time, all the time. That's exactly what I'm referring to. You feel a lick, a fill, a groove. You play it. You play all the notes in their proper places. But it doesn't sound like what you imagined. It's not smooth, and doesn't flow. The execution is to blame, right? What else could it be that went wrong? (assuming that your idea sounded smooth and flowed nicely in your mind)

well, I think that's just part of playing anything, or writing anything. Things don't always sound as good, or read as good as we imagined in our head. That's why we flesh out parts, and practice them if they're not executed the first time properly, or don't sound right. Even the pros do this. There are certain people that can nail anything immediately, but that's probably only 1% of players that can do that. For me, I think it's better that I can't nail everything the first time. If I could I think I would get bored and lazy, and would lose interest in playing because everything was too easy. Practice is simply the answer to all your problems, and nothing else will come close. Even prodigies practice for hours a day, which is the real reason they're as good as they are.

If you're talking about just jamming and playing everything on the fly, then that's different. Some people just aren't good with spontaneity no matter how much they practice. One of the guitarists in my band can't jam for crap, but he can write songs, so for some people there just needs to be an element of control. But, I think if you have more of an arsenal to draw from it'll certainly be easier. The more you know, the more you have to draw from on the fly without thinking. And, the more you practice, the better the execution will be.
 
There are a great many things that I would never attempt to play. I can hear them in my head just fine but maybe the most important thing, maybe, is to get so in touch with your body that you'll always be able to pull off whatever your body plays the best.

I never was and never will be a Billy Cobham or someone like that. I can hear what he plays but it's not in me to play like that. What's in me is to play like I play. To me that's the challenge, to find your own unique place, your own voice, on the drums.

See, nailing something just right is more than technique, I think. It's getting your own concept together, your own approach, your own special way of speaking. When its time to play a fill or a lick, to play something that punches the music up a few notches, that's the time to say "HERE I AM. THIS IS ME, MY IDEA, MY VOICE!" That's what will set you apart.

Execution is only part of it, an important part, of course, but equally important is to dig deep down into yourself, to get to be the expert on what you want to say on the drums and how to do that.

Anyway that's just what I think.

love this post Conrad, its very true.

this whole thread is pretty timely for me as im currently trying to nail a part in a song that is troubling me greatly! the lick is just on the edge of my capabilities right now but im purpously pushing things and myself! when i heard it recorded the other week i said to our friend who was taking charge of the recording stuff, '' if i heard that recorded by someone else i couldn't even work out what was being played there "

now, the part is no technical masterpiece but it was quite shock to hear an idea played back that you have been grasping at for a while, in short it wasnt how i thought it sounded!

moral? over thinking things makes it definatey harder for me to execute but when it flows and i nail that part it feels INCREDIBLE. oh and dont always trust that tape machine in your head... it frequently lies to you!

as Construct noted above, findng your own voice and freeing your mind is the goal!! cliche or no cliche thats what its about for me anyway.
 
Some talk here about the gap between what we think we're doing and the playback. Sometimes I think I've played well but the playback stank. At other times I thought I played well and the playback bears this out. Different states of mind.

One time that I remember playing well I'd decided it was all about harmonising. So I spent the day at work beforehand trying to harmonise with my surroundings and everyone in it as much as possible ... as opposed to the egocentric edginess that seems to be an unfortunate life habit. At no point during the day did I do anything or say anything for myself; I was just being as responsive as possible.

Then, when I was in the rehearsal room I aimed to harmonise as as much as possible the whole time, not just when playing but also between songs - every word I spoke, every little warm up stroke or noodling I played had to fit as much as possible with my aural surroundings - as though there was no difference between songs and non-songs.

The whole band played well all evening (by our standards) and the playbacks confirmed it. We drummers really do play a huge role in our bands' performances.

However, all this determined harmonising takes a lot more focus and concentration than I can usually muster. I imagine meditation and yoga approached with a good attitude would help. Ideally, getting our mental game together with drumming should be a holistic thing that also involves actualising more as human beings generally.
 
I can totally relate, and it has to do with allowing yourself to be in the moment and trust that you will be able to play that fill when the time comes and just wait for it. As soon as you start to think, analyse, you are taken out of the moment, and quite possibly out of the pocket.

I also practice meditation and when someone is feeling pure awareness (bliss) and you all of a sudden start to think about it, during meditation, IT is gone!! It takes practice to be in the moment but practice involves trying something which is exactly what you don't want to do. It is more like praticing letting go.

In that sense drumming is a form of meditation and when we are in the zone we are not thinking (pure awareness) just feeling, but start to analyse it and it's gone.
 
Some talk here about the gap between what we think we're doing and the playback. Sometimes I think I've played well but the playback stank. At other times I thought I played well and the playback bears this out. Different states of mind

This is it in a nutshell. The gap between what you think and what you play. The goal is to have them one in the same, that's my lifelong quest.

I also practice meditation and when someone is feeling pure awareness (bliss) and you all of a sudden start to think about it, during meditation, IT is gone!! It takes practice to be in the moment but practice involves trying something which is exactly what you don't want to do. It is more like praticing letting go.

In that sense drumming is a form of meditation and when we are in the zone we are not thinking (pure awareness) just feeling, but start to analyse it and it's gone.

Excellent assessment. Saying it is one thing but putting it into practice on a regular basis is something much harder. Hey sometimes it works, and sometimes it aint happening. Sometimes it's working, but there are clinker moments, who can maintain 100% all the time?
 
This is it in a nutshell. The gap between what you think and what you play. The goal is to have them one in the same, that's my lifelong quest.

.... Hey sometimes it works, and sometimes it aint happening. Sometimes it's working, but there are clinker moments, who can maintain 100% all the time?

It's not about 100% for me. For some reason my competence has a wide range. As a former boss once said to me, "Grea, there are some days when if I needed brain surgery, I'd want you to be the one to do it. There are other days when i wouldn't trust you to tie my shoe laces" (after one of my "shoelace moments").

It's the same deal musically for me. Some people are naturally more consistent and reliable than others. The standard answer to the question of consistency is practice. But if you are a naturally inconsistent person then you have to do a helluva lot more practice to be consistent, and even then you'll be more flaky than other players.

I remember reading a review of a top Aussie pop band's gig. The reviewer was saying that when the bassist was "on" he was fluid and classy, but on his off nights he clung to the basic riffs like a lifeline. I guess that means is we ideally should have a baseline (not bassline :) approach to a song that we can adorn if the muse is with us ... as long as we can be sure we're not engaging in that aural airbrushing where we think we're kicking butt but later find out we were just pushing sh1t up a hill :)

Hmm, rudimental meditation ... mamma-daddies instead of "Om" ... two birds with one stone ... I've always been too caught up in trying to do it "right" for it to be meditative ...

// end thinking aloud //
 
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