Istanbul Launches 1960's Tony Williams Tribute Cymbals

Scott K Fish

Scott K Fish

Silver Member
NAMM 2015: Istanbul launches Tony Williams tribute cymbals
Based meticulous study of Tony's original cymbals
RhythmJanuary 16, 2015, 08:30 UTC

tony-williams-169-630-80.jpg


NAMM 2015: Turkish cymbal maker Istanbul has announced an exciting new line, crafted in tribute to legendary drummer Tony Williams, created as faithful replicas of the now iconic cymbals made famous by Tony on the recordings of the '60s era Miles Davis Quintet. These exclusive new cymbals will be made available initially as limited edition numbered sets.

Istanbul was granted exclusive access to the very same cymbals, made in Istanbul in the late '50s, ...used by Tony Williams on the Miles Davis Quintet's historic recordings. These cymbals were given to Tony by...Max Roach. Colleen Williams, Tony's wife, hand carried the precious cymbals to Turkey where the master artisans meticulously measured, weighed, gauged and recorded every facet of them.

Tony Williams Tribute Cymbal Limited Edition sets feature 22'' ride, 18'' crash and 14'' hi-hats together with a deluxe leather cymbal bag, a selection of rare Tony Williams photographs and a certificate of authenticity.

Colleen Williams. ''It was a profound experience to attend this 'rebirth' of something Tony loved and treasured...''

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Scott K Fish Blog: Life Beyond the Cymbals
 
this is a nice gesture and I am sure some suckers will fall for this .... anything for a buck I guess

but what people need to understand is that 90% of the sound that came off those cymbals were a direct result of the man hitting them

I have a friend here in NYC who played with one of Wallace Roneys bands in the early 2000s

Tony gave Wallace quite a few of his old Ks that he played on some of those historic records

my buddy got a chance twice to be in the presence of these cymbals....

he told me quite a few of them were cracked right at the center hole and Wallace wouldn't let him touch any of those .... but he did get to tap on 3 of them ....

he said that one in particular had a very warn in spot right in the center band and he could tell it had been used extensively

he told me that surprisingly if that one was in a stack of cymbals that he was choosing from he would have probably thrown it aside as ones he would not have picked ..... he said that they were slightly heavier than he had thought and that none of them sounded particularly good

so where I am sure that this is a valiant effort by Istanbul..... a very fine cymbal making establishment ..

...I think this is a ploy more to exploit consumers using Tonys name more than anything
 
Red Menace said:
I just felt it in my heart that Amodo would be the first one to comment on this thread.

Any word on what these will be retailing at?
Click to expand...

Amodeo is the spelling .... but thanks for thinking of me

and the set will probably be some ridiculous price like $3000.00
 
WhoIsTony? said:
Amodeo is the spelling .... but thanks for thinking of me
Click to expand...

Ah, thanks. I didn't want to refer to you as Tony because that would just lead to confusion as we're talking about Tony Williams.

On a slightly different subject I remember reading in a review of the K Dark Medium ride that it was the closest to the Nefertiti ride that the writer had ever found. I'd like to get your thought on this.
 
I think their whole marketing of this stinks.

Tony didn't endorse the Istanbul brand.

Tony isn't here to endorse it, or defend himself from endorsing it. Using his name for commercial purposes like this is just lame.

Plus we're talking cymbals that were and are hand crafted so that no two sound 100% exactly alike.
 
Red Menace said:
Ah, thanks. I didn't want to refer to you as Tony because that would just lead to confusion as we're talking about Tony Williams.

On a slightly different subject I remember reading in a review of the K Dark Medium ride that it was the closest to the Nefertiti ride that the writer had ever found. I'd like to get your thought on this.
Click to expand...

Tony had many different ride cymbal sounds ... but they all had a very trashy sound when crashed

the K Dark Medium doesn't really have that

be it a popular thing or not to do in the court of public opinion ..... I have spent quite a while searching for that sound , or something close to it when it comes off my hands

and the closest think I have found was the K Custom Dry Complex medium 22"

that cymbal is long discontinued .... and you can hear it here along with yours truly butchering some Tony transcriptions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AUFsNyczNI
 
I am not one for signature instruments or labels but I can see where they are coming from. If they had access to Tony's cymbals then I would presume, them being cymbal manufacturers, that these will be a fairly faithfull representation.

If they manufactured the cymbals to sound just like the originals sounded when the tester played them, then I believe they will probably sound the same as the originals, If Tony played the new ones now. But he cant so we will never know for sure.
 
I'll pass. Remember Jack DeJonette's first signature cymbal line...?

Not saying these will be as bad, but even Buddy Rich didn't fully comprehend how to tune a snare drum later in life.

Max could pick out some good cymbals, I've heard some of them, but doesn't mean he gave his gems to Tony either.

Lots of grey water here. Im sure ISTANBUL will be making them sound good, watch out for the up charge from the name a$$ociation tho.
 
It's a way to capitalize on Tony's name. Those records were made 50 years ago. Those cymbals wouldn't sound the same even if they hadn't been worn or damaged. It's a romantic notion, but that sound came from how Tony played, how they were recorded, etc.
 
WhoIsTony? said:
he said that one in particular had a very warn in spot right in the center band and he could tell it had been used extensively
Click to expand...

intriguing. i would love to have a cymbal with such history, even if not tony's.

i have been hurting my head the last few minutes trying to think how many taps, or just how "used" it was to get this.
let's see, even keeping say just quarter note pulse at 120 bpm, playing 3 hours per night, say at least 100 nights per year, for x years.....hmmmm
 
opentune said:
intriguing. i would love to have a cymbal with such history, even if not tony's.

i have been hurting my head the last few minutes trying to think how many taps, or just how "used" it was to get this.
let's see, even keeping say just quarter note pulse at 120 bpm, playing 3 hours per night, say at least 100 nights per year, for x years.....hmmmm
Click to expand...
Heh, with that quintet, Tony was probably averaging closer to 300 bpm :)
 
opentune said:
intriguing. i would love to have a cymbal with such history, even if not tony's.

i have been hurting my head the last few minutes trying to think how many taps, or just how "used" it was to get this.
let's see, even keeping say just quarter note pulse at 120 bpm, playing 3 hours per night, say at least 100 nights per year, for x years.....hmmmm
Click to expand...

for some reason I can't find the footage right now .... but there is a video on YoutTube of Tony playing with Miles and from one angle you get a great shot of hist ride cymbal with a beautiful warn spot

now who knows if it was that cymbal .... and the chances of it being are slim.... but I have always pictured it being that one having never seen the cymbal he got to play over at Wallace Roneys place
 
At the end of the day, who cares? You either like the sound of a cymbal or you dont. Be it brand new, 60 years old, cost £50 or £500, its personal taste in the end.

I know from long experience that just because an instrument is old does not mean, by default, it will sound better than a brand new instrument, very often the oposite.
 
Why not wait to see what they sound like before judging them.

Just say they were a home run, and they really got it right. Would that be a good thing or would it dilute the mystique?
 
From video of the Miles Davis Quintet in Europe, and in still photos of Tony overseas with Miles - I wonder how often he played on kits, including cymbals, other than his own.

On "Miles in Europe" it sounds like Tony's playing single-headed drums.

skf
 
The reason this doesn't sit well with me is for the same reasons that Ludwig wheeling out a Bonham vistalite at every NAMM show doesn't sit right with me.
 
My K Dark Medium Ride is certainly trashy. The only cymbal trashier than that I've owned is the 22" Agop SE Jazz TW Ride - and to my ear, the 22 K Dark sounds closer to the Nefertiti ride than the Agop, which I must admit I was quite surprised about...



WhoIsTony? said:
Tony had many different ride cymbal sounds ... but they all had a very trashy sound when crashed

the K Dark Medium doesn't really have that

be it a popular thing or not to do in the court of public opinion ..... I have spent quite a while searching for that sound , or something close to it when it comes off my hands

and the closest think I have found was the K Custom Dry Complex medium 22"

that cymbal is long discontinued .... and you can hear it here along with yours truly butchering some Tony transcriptions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AUFsNyczNI
Click to expand...
 
Looks like $2k for a set, so despite them appealing to me sonically and historically, I will stick (no pun intended) with cymbals I can play without any fear of damage or loss.
 
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