Most Underrated Drummer - Male + Female?

Steve Smith - Journey His solo work is amazing. (when he started getting bald)

I don't really know any girl drummers other than Meg White so I'll choose another guy

Mitch Mitchel - Jimi Hendrix Experience. I love how he does the fills in Purple Haze.
 
Gary novak superior to the leauge of the top jazz cats mentioned but yet unrecognized amongst them! Great pocket, swing, imagination, and finger lickin' licks!
 
I was always surprised that over the last few decades so few people rated Aynsley Dunbar. He could apply his distinctive stye to rock (Bowie, Journey), pop (Ian Hunter), alt (Lou Reed), prog, jazz and fusion (Zappa and early Journey).

The trouble with the way some people rate drummers, especially noobs, is they underrate creativity in composing parts and steadiness of groove, as though they are simple givens to be taken for granted.

For them, the ability to play very difficult parts is the only measure - more of a sporting approach than a musical one.
 
I have two guys in mind, and I'll provide links to songs they've played in so you guys can hear them if you haven't before.

Steve Clifford of Circa Survive.
I see no love for him anywhere outside of the community of Circa Survive fans, but this guy is extremely creative and capable of holding down beats with feeling in multiple time signatures. He's also very mutli-genred. The band he played with before Circa Survive was metal and he showed just as much mastery as he does with Circa Survive, who play a completely different style.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oG184zmL62M
Stop The Fuckin' Car - Circa Survive

Andrew Forsman of Fall Of Troy
Here's another drummer I rarely see any love for. Just for the sheer fact that he can keep up with the musicianship in Fall Of Troy and do it interestingly and with style says something. He's also becoming a teacher, and that's always respectable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18vCFozYuvY
Semi-Fiction - Fall Of Troy
 
Hey everyone; what about Brian Downey of Thin Lizzy!!! That guy was and is an incredible talent who can lay down some of the coolest, funky beats in a rock setting (Johnny the Fox). He can solo with the best of them; but it is the little subtleties that I guess are not noticed by non drummers which make him stand out.
Also, a guy called Russell Gilbrook is worth checking out. I have seen him in clinic twice and his variation from Jazz and swing to metal is very impressive.
On the Ringo thing; I think it was the era in which he played and the hysteria around the band which made him an idol. He was not a bad drummer but I cannot see him as anything other than capable and proficient!
 
Jerry Gaskill is extremely underrated in my opinion . . . as is the rest of the band (King's X), both as a band and individually.

Most underrated female . . . I don't know, really, because most of the female drummers that I'm a fan of, like Cindy Blackman, do not seem to be underrated by folks familiar with them, they're just not "household names".
 
After listening to a bunch of John Lennon this week, I'm going to seek out more of Andy Newmark's stuff. He's the type of drummer you've heard a thousand times, because he's on a ton of great things- including Sly Stone's Fresh and Lennon's Double Fantasy- but he's not exactly a household name. His old MD interview also influenced my thinking about the toms; he said he tuned them to a real wide interval (I think he used a 12 and 16), which I'm back to doing recently.
 
toddbishop said:
After listening to a bunch of John Lennon this week, I'm going to seek out more of Andy Newmark's stuff. He's the type of drummer you've heard a thousand times, because he's on a ton of great things- including Sly Stone's Fresh and Lennon's Double Fantasy- but he's not exactly a household name. His old MD interview also influenced my thinking about the toms; he said he tuned them to a real wide interval (I think he used a 12 and 16), which I'm back to doing recently.
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Speaking of Lennon, Ringo drums in his and Yoko's Plastic Ono Band albums.
 
Malti said:
Am trying to get to that movie this weekend. Just curious if you or anyone has seen it.
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Sorry this is late. But I watched it last month. It's a good film because of the performances by Dakota Fanning, Michael Shannon, and Kristen Stewart. It's mostly about Cherie Currie, so you'll be dissapointed if you come into it expecting the stories of all the members.
 
Pollyanna said:
I was always surprised that over the last few decades so few people rated Aynsley Dunbar. He could apply his distinctive stye to rock (Bowie, Journey), pop (Ian Hunter), alt (Lou Reed), prog, jazz and fusion (Zappa and early Journey).

The trouble with the way some people rate drummers, especially noobs, is they underrate creativity in composing parts and steadiness of groove, as though they are simple givens to be taken for granted.

For them, the ability to play very difficult parts is the only measure - more of a sporting approach than a musical one.
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What a superb post. Nailed the rating game for me perfectly.

My choice of male, Prairy Prince of "The Tubes" fame. Such a potent combination of driving backbeat groove, interpretation & performance.

My choice of female has to be Karen Carpenter. Although recently recognised in Drummerworld (thanks Bernhard), still not universally recognised for her drumming prowess. Partially because of her sublime vocal talent over shadowing her drumming contribution, & partially because female drummers in the 70's were regarded as a less than serious novelty. (totally wrong, of course)

BTW, Mandala, that drumming in Circa Survive is the best example of appropriate gross overplaying I've heard in a long time!
 
keep it simple said:
What a superb post. Nailed the rating game for me perfectly.

My choice of male, Prairy Prince of "The Tubes" fame. Such a potent combination of driving backbeat groove, interpretation & performance.

My choice of female has to be Karen Carpenter. Although recently recognised in Drummerworld (thanks Bernhard), still not universally recognised for her drumming prowess. Partially because of her sublime vocal talent over shadowing her drumming contribution, & partially because female drummers in the 70's were regarded as a less than serious novelty. (totally wrong, of course)

BTW, Mandala, that drumming in Circa Survive is the best example of appropriate gross overplaying I've heard in a long time!
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Cheers Andy, it's a dirty job just someone had to say it.

Creative drum parts are so taken for granted. Since they are integrated into the song noobs and laypersons think it's the only way the song could have been played.

Noobs and groove are a funny combo ... since all pro recordings have a solid groove it's taken as a given that that's what happens when any drummer plays LOL

Then they spend years wondering why they don't seem to be regarded as highly as "lesser drummers" who, to them, are just playing the beat with hardly any fills or nuffin'!. It's kind of cute, really, like watching a puppy chasing its tail. It pissed me off at the time, though haha

Prairie Prince & Karen C are good choices - fab players, rarely rated.

Prairie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQqJDFJouYA
Karen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dJUnh6N8-U
 
+1 to Pollyanna's posts, I couldn't agree more. Only once I started recording myself playing did I realize that I can barely play a steady groove! It takes even more work to play it with real feeling and passion like the best players out there do.

megadave said:
Also Kris Myers of Umphrey's McGee. Plays circles around most drummers today.
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Spot on for most underrated drummer (Fishman is dope as well, but in my experience much more well known). In my opinion, Kris is up there with the likes of Steve Gadd, Vinnie Colaiuta, Jojo Mayer, and other such talented players. Kris has the chops, and can lay it down in ANY genre, but most importantly he has tasteful playing. He knows when to keep it simple, but he also plays dense, intricate patterns when the music calls for it. Please, if you haven't heard Kris play before, check it out (Kris is on the kit. The conguero is Andy Farag, another tasteful player of Umphrey's)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9n3HPeta6s&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygq-XBH87pE&feature=related

Take note the playing in those videos is done on a Pearl Rhythm Traveler. it's the player, not the drum.

As for the most underatted female, I'm gonna have to agree with keep it simple's contribution of Karen Carpenter. I heard my parents listen to the carpenters for years before I knew that she was playing those rock solid drum tracks. And of course she had a beautiful voice as well (though it's probably more well known that her drumming)
 
Dean Castranova. I've never really herd anyone talk about him. He's the drummer in journey now.
 
Kirk Covington, Paul Wertico, Gary Novak, Joey Heredia, Bob Gatzen...all are underrated as they never get any mention in conversation though they certainly should.

Sheila E, Cindy Blackman and Karen Carpenter don't get recognized often enough.

Ringo Starr is definitely not underrated or overrated as a drummer. He was the perfect choice to compliment the Beatles...obviously because he was simply with the Beatles while Paul and John wrote such completely amazing and genius songs that quite frankly they didn't even need a drummer. Anybody could have played drums for the Beatles and they would have still been so magnificent because the songwriting genius was almost 'superhuman'. I think John Lennon was as meaningful as Jesus or Buddha or Vishnu or Osiris or Mohammed. Ringo, Paul and George were like disciples with equal footing.
 
Malti said:
Am trying to get to that movie this weekend. Just curious if you or anyone has seen it.
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Finally. A post about Sandy West. i started a thread for her in the players section and mentioned her a few times. no bites.

thank you.
 
I've always liked Bun E. Carlos from Cheap Trick. I know his playing is simple and straight-forward, but I think that's a good thing sometimes. He always has a great sound too.
 
if you mean "not known as well as their ability deserves" then:

Pierre Moerlen

Pip Pyle

Christian Vander

Clayton Cameron
 
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