Switching from rock to other styles

Hmm, it looks like most drummers who start with rock stay put.
Yup, that's me. To some extent, I feel very jealous of players who can master a number of styles. The key word here being "master". I can play bits & pieces of styles other than rock, but they in no way convince me, never mind anyone else. The truth is, I lack both the skills and the motivation to stray away from my soul of rock. That doen't necessarily mean I'm taking the easy option, it's just an honest recognition of my lack of ability and the huge enjoyment I get from playing stuff that sits in my soul. I have so much room to grow within my own genre without making life even more difficult. Just about the only other related genre I'm convincing in is funk. I'd say my default playing style is funky rock so that's not too surprising.

As a contrast to my playing, my musical tastes are very varied indeed, but I decided years ago that I'm better appreciating the performances of others from the sidelines than woodshedding something that needs to be forced rather tham emerge naturally. I guess taking a 25 year break from drumming didn't exactly help my progression either.

Many players stick with simple rock stuff because they genuinely can't do anything else. I think I have the potential to break away but I've taken a concious decision to continue enjoying what I do and growing as a result. The old saying "jack of all trades, master of non" springs to mind. Very rarely, a player trancends genre boundries and becomes a true exponent of many styles. That, IMO, is extremely rare and a gift bestowed on the back of a lifetime of dedication. That will not, and cannot, be me, so I sit here very happy in my shell.
 
I played in rock bands for a long time and now I'm in a band that plays loungey music - soul, jazz ballads etc. After a year, I still find rock much easier and more natural to play. I don't have to hold back and can just go for it.

Have you shifted from rock to other styles? How have you found it? What have been the main challenges?

Yes, i changed from Rock to Jazz twenty years ago. I always thought, this is a natural development in taste, finesse, music, technique.

This year i joined a Rockband - filling in for a limited time, because their good drummer did a longer travel. All 60's stuff - Stones to Deep Purple, also some Otis Redding and Wilson Pickett...Vanilla Fudge and also Status Quo...

...what should i say:
I really came back to live, love the pure power of the rough guitars from their Marshalls, Oranges and VoX, and i enjoyed this music much more as everything. I'm also sure, i play much better now and with more clearity as back then in the days. Also adding some double bass stuff for a little spicing up...so great. I hated the day their drummer came back, i think i will get him a one way ticket to Australia or Newfoundland....

Bernhard
 
I really came back to live, love the pure power of the rough guitars from their Marshalls, Oranges and VoX, and i enjoyed this music much more as everything. I'm also sure, i play much better now and with more clearity as back then in the days. Also adding some double bass stuff for a little spicing up...so great. I hated the day their drummer came back, i think i will get him a one way ticket to Australia or Newfoundland....

Bernhard

that is so awesome! yes i can imagine that jazz really improves you and takes you to a different level of rock drumming.. great!
 
Many players stick with simple rock stuff because they genuinely can't do anything else. I think I have the potential to break away but I've taken a concious decision to continue enjoying what I do and growing as a result. The old saying "jack of all trades, master of non" springs to mind. Very rarely, a player trancends genre boundries and becomes a true exponent of many styles. That, IMO, is extremely rare and a gift bestowed on the back of a lifetime of dedication. That will not, and cannot, be me, so I sit here very happy in my shell.
I don't really think that's the case, at least, not for me. I mean, anyone can play any style if they enjoy it, and practice it. There's no reason for people not to be able to master many different styles, but most people start drumming in a particular style and stick with it because they enjoy it, perhaps with the style evolving as their musical tastes change. I don't think it has anything to do with rock drummers specifically not being able to do anything else, it's a matter of them not WANTING to do anything else. I started with rock music because I enjoy rock music, and have started playing metal because I enjoy metal. If I were more into jazz or other music, I'd probably venture into other styles, but I like what I do and am fairly comfortable with it.
 
that's quite true too. sometimes people just really enjoy a certain genre. but saying that, i don't think i could personally only stick to one or two styles of music, i have to constantly learn new things. i suppose i want to make my own style of drumming that covers multiple genres, but always sounds like me. thats my dream anyway. one day, hehe. but for sure, i still play the same genres that i enjoyed when i was 13 from time to time, its just now i totally own it.
 
i'm trying my best to learn some more genres and styles besides good old rock and roll. my drum teacher is one of those rare people who can masterfully play in a whole range of styles. he's been helping me quite a lot. he is quick to point out my rock tendencies when i attempt to play jazz and latin styles, and is always encouraging me to be as authentic as possible. i may never really master those other styles, but i sure am having fun trying!
 
The truth is, I lack both the skills and the motivation to stray away from my soul of rock.... I have so much room to grow within my own genre without making life even more difficult.

Me too, KIS. I've always been a somewhat jazz-influenced rock drummer, but only in a superficial way The only reason I've switched is because I've been playing with our singer through a few bands and we're very good friends and musically compatible. He's commented that I always sound best when we play the rockier numbers. You can take the girl out of rock but ...

Nothing wrong with sticking to a genre. I'd love to play rock again but not so much that I'll do anything about it :)


Yes, i changed from Rock to Jazz twenty years ago. I always thought, this is a natural development in taste, finesse, music, technique.

This year i joined a Rockband ... I really came back to live, love the pure power of the rough guitars from their Marshalls, Oranges and VoX, and i enjoyed this music much more as everything. I'm also sure, i play much better now and with more clearity as back then in the days.

How did you find the transition from rock to jazz, Bernhard? What were the key differences?

It seems that all the practice needed to play more complex drumming styles carried over but you never lost that rock attitude.


drum teacher ... is quick to point out my rock tendencies when i attempt to play jazz and latin styles, and is always encouraging me to be as authentic as possible.

Dairy, what are the rocky things in your playing that he's pointing out? What are you finding that you have to "un-rock" to play jazz and Latin?
 
Dairy, what are the rocky things in your playing that he's pointing out? What are you finding that you have to "un-rock" to play jazz and Latin?

let's see. when i first started playing jazz i was way too stiff with my grip on the ride cymbal, as my teacher was quick to point out. if you look at the good jazz players, they're barely hanging onto the stick. i managed to loosen my grip quite a bit and now i play the ride with a looser more swinging flow. i've made good progress, but i still have lots of room for improvement.

another thing i was doing was hitting the toms like a rock player when playing jazz. i was getting way too punchy a sound out of them. he pointed out that in jazz you don't need to pound everything, and a lot of times you barely touch the drums. i've worked really hard to lighten up my playing and make it more finesse oriented, but it's tough! i've been in bands right up to the present time where i'm playing absolutely as a hard as i can most of the time, so it's tough to all of a sudden become a "finesse player", but i'm working on it.

yet another thing i have trouble with, both with latin and jazz it to play fills that have a "jazz feel" or a "latin feel". i can play a basic swing pattern or a basic son clave groove, but when it comes to embellishing those grooves i tend to do it in more of a "rock" style. for example, i'll play a series of sixteenth notes on the toms. a fill like that is not normally played in either jazz or latin music. to remedy this, i've been listening to a lot of jazz and latin music trying to get a better idea of how to decorate my playing in a way that's more in keeping with those styles. i have some instructional books and cds that have also been helpful. it's not easy because rock is in my blood and i'm really not all that familiar with those other styles. after practicing *a lot* i've made some solid progress and there is hope. i'm getting there!
 
Thanks Dairy, that was super-interesting.

another thing i was doing was hitting the toms like a rock player when playing jazz. i was getting way too punchy a sound out of them. he pointed out that in jazz you don't need to pound everything, and a lot of times you barely touch the drums. i've worked really hard to lighten up my playing and make it more finesse oriented, but it's tough!

This is the bit that gets me. When I play light, unless I'm very careful all the energy goes from it.

Yet you hear good jazzers and they have so much control that even when gently caressing the instrument there's heaps of intensity and groove. Lots of fine motor stuff going on and I'm a bit of a clumsy elephant by comparison.
 
This is the bit that gets me. When I play light, unless I'm very careful all the energy goes from it.

Yet you hear good jazzers and they have so much control that even when gently caressing the instrument there's heaps of intensity and groove. Lots of fine motor stuff going on and I'm a bit of a clumsy elephant by comparison.

i'm in the same boat with you 100%. attempting to learn these other styles in an authentic way has been a real eye opener for me. it's given me a whole new respect for jazz and latin players. it's not easy at all, but it has been extremely enlightening and i really believe i've grown tremendously as a drummer and a musician. and like i said, i'm still working on it!
 
i'm in the same boat with you 100%. attempting to learn these other styles in an authentic way has been a real eye opener for me. it's given me a whole new respect for jazz and latin players. it's not easy at all, but it has been extremely enlightening and i really believe i've grown tremendously as a drummer and a musician. and like i said, i'm still working on it!

Yes, that's where I'm coming from. I don't think rock (discount advanced prog etc) requires the same amount of control as genres that demand precision in small increments. You can't just whale away and sound cool. The extra control should result in you being a better all-round drummer, just as it did for Bernhard.

You sometimes hear that jazz players can have trouble playing rock authentically, most famously the tale about Buddy Rich (not sure of its veracity). If there is an issue there it's probably attitude. There may also be an issue with boredom and taste.

Most hotshot rockers have a gung ho sense about their playing that makes it exciting. I suspect it's partly about relationship to the beat (on centre, ahead, behind) or the amount of push/pull.
 
It seems like an answer that everyone would say, but it's the truth - listen to as much as you can. Instead of just hearing what's being played, listen to it and picture yourself playing it. All you can do is just familiarize yourself with as many styles as possible and play them. Eventually, you'll be comfortable in a lot more things.
 
Most hotshot rockers have a gung ho sense about their playing that makes it exciting. I suspect it's partly about relationship to the beat (on centre, ahead, behind) or the amount of push/pull.

you're absolutely right about that. the way a groove floats around relative to the metronome makes a big difference. my teacher (the great fount of drumming wisdom) is always talking about that. he showed me how a jazz ride pattern can be varied tremendously by accenting differently or moving the skip beat forward or back in time to make it sound more triplet-y or more like straight sixteenths. likewise, latin grooves often have a "lilt" to them where the clave pattern doesn't quite line up perfectly with the metronome. depending on how you play it, it can sound like it's in 4/4 time or 6/8, or more often somewhere in between. it's those little subtleties that define the styles and make them so hard to reproduce authentically.
 
great posts, some great info from everyone! :)

For me there are two parts to learning musical styles that I am not familiar with.

1) Listen to the music a lot. The more you listen, the better you play the style. It helps if you really like what you are hearing. ( In fact, if you don't like the style, there's no real point in learning to play it.)

2) Get the info about how its played from where ever you can, learn from the masters, take lessons, etc.

I am sure that if one immerses themselves in a style of music for a few years a good level of feeling the style and playing it can be reached.

Happy drumming!!

Ami
 
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