Would like some feedback on my hand technique

Km6543

Senior Member
I'd like to get some feedback on my hand technique. The reason I ask is that I sometimes get pain in the area between the index finger and thumb, and it could be that I am overgripping or tightening up. I don't notice this in my left hand at all, just my right. So I am trying to determine if I really am playing okay or if there are any areas where I need to adjust my technique. Any tips? Thanks!

(Sorry if the video isn't very good or the hi hat stand is in the way. I had a hard time finding a good angle here.)

http://youtu.be/sdzQxgdmBOc
 
I'm not really in a position to critique anyone's technique, because there's a lot of different ways to move a drumstick, but as far as the pain between your index and thumb...is it muscle pain? My first thought was that you are strengthening your thumb muscle, which lives between your index and your thumb. Your thumb is the only opposing force to keep the stick in your hand and that muscle has to be strong enough to be able to relax slightly and still maintain grip. It sounds to me like the pain is normal. Unless it's not a muscle burning pain and it's something nervy or bone related. A strong thumb is crucial to matched grip.

Beyond that, the only thing I would say, is to observe your strong hand and compare your weak hand technique to your strong hand technique. Try and get them to use the same exact muscles.

For years I unknowingly used 2 different techniques. On my weak hand my thumb was locked straight and I used my fingers to motivate the stick and on my strong hand my thumb was actually initiating the stroke, and bending 90 degrees at the thumb knuckle. Very different techniques. Once I realized this and started to correct it, my SSR's really evened out. My weak hand thumb muscle was not nearly as developed as my strong hand thumb muscle, and strengthening it was a really great thing for my weak hand, and in turn, my SSR's.
 
I'm not really in a position to critique anyone's technique, because there's a lot of different ways to move a drumstick, but as far as the pain between your index and thumb...is it muscle pain? My first thought was that you are strengthening your thumb muscle, which lives between your index and your thumb.

It feels like a repetitive strain injury possibly, and often kicks in within moments from when I start playing.
 
I'd like to get some feedback on my hand technique. The reason I ask is that I sometimes get pain in the area between the index finger and thumb, and it could be that I am overgripping or tightening up. I don't notice this in my left hand at all, just my right. So I am trying to determine if I really am playing okay or if there are any areas where I need to adjust my technique. Any tips? Thanks!

(Sorry if the video isn't very good or the hi hat stand is in the way. I had a hard time finding a good angle here.)

http://youtu.be/sdzQxgdmBOc
Hard to tell from the video. It looks as though your right and left hands are not even. I can see it more easily when you switched to single strokes. Your fingers and grip appear much more loose and open with the left hand. Is your thumb on the side/underneath the stick with the left hand? I'm going to guess you are gripping too tightly in the fulcrum with the right hand, and you are absorbing the impact, but someone more qualified should be able to help you.
 
Looks like you might be compressing your ulnar nerve.. I think that Jai Es does a bunch of drum related videos on it, and it's one of the causes of the "My right hand falls asleep" posts that you will find on this and other drumming boards.
 
I can't tell you exactly what's causing the pain-- obviously something's wrong with your grip/stroke-- but here's what I'm seeing, real quick:
1) You're changing your grip a lot, especially on the single stroke roll.
2) You're using a lot of arm to make your accents.
3) You're kind of just whacking the pad-- the softest thing you play is still a regular concert snare drummer's ff.
4) When you switch to "French" grip to do the SSR your middle fingers are coming off the stick.
5) Your doubles are dying-- the second note is just a bounce, and is much softer than the first note.
6) You seem to be relying on your arms and the bounce of the pad to pick up your sticks-- not much going on with your wrists in that department.

What I think you should do: Start doing your snare drum practice in front of a mirror, and just try to get your basic, mostly-wrist, "German" grip together, maintaining your form through everything you do-- no switching to French grip when you feel like it, and without using arm to make your accents and doubles. I'd try using very little arm and finger for awhile, keeping a very light but controlled grip with even pressure through all of your fingers. I would look up the best concert percussionist/timpanist or jazz drummer you can find and get some lessons. There are a lot of little Jojo Mayers floating around, who have gotten reasonably good at his thing on practice pad, but I don't think those are the people you should be seeking out.
 
Thanks for the replies everyone.

I tried lowering the snare to make it more level, and seeing if that would make a difference. Here's another recording.

http://youtu.be/C-urImnRhII

What it feels like though is that I cannot seem to get the drums positioned in a way where playing is comfortable. If I raise the snare, I can't hit the head. If it's too low, I can't do rimshots. Maybe it's too close to me, maybe too far away. Maybe the pad or playing area is just too small, and it's hard to get a really centered position on it - no matter how I position everything I'm still "torquing" my body somewhere to be able to hit it. Just brainstorming here really.
 
I can't tell you exactly what's causing the pain-- obviously something's wrong with your grip/stroke-- but here's what I'm seeing, real quick:
1) You're changing your grip a lot, especially on the single stroke roll.
2) You're using a lot of arm to make your accents.
3) You're kind of just whacking the pad-- the softest thing you play is still a regular concert snare drummer's ff.
4) When you switch to "French" grip to do the SSR your middle fingers are coming off the stick.
5) Your doubles are dying-- the second note is just a bounce, and is much softer than the first note.
6) You seem to be relying on your arms and the bounce of the pad to pick up your sticks-- not much going on with your wrists in that department.

Thanks for the comments. What do you mean by your third comment? Are you saying I'm hitting too hard? I have always been told I am a soft hitter.
 
Thanks for the comments. What do you mean by your third comment? Are you saying I'm hitting too hard? I have always been told I am a soft hitter.

Sure, I hope that helps. Re: #3, if you do what you're doing on an actual snare drum, I think you'll hear what I mean-- you'll be hurting your ears, and not getting a very good tone. Plain old generic good modern snare drum technique (as I know it, anyway) is designed to operate in a zone of about 1"-14" stick heights. If you bring your heights down quite a bit, simplify your stroke, and maintain good form (wrists flat, sticks making a 90 deg piece of pie on the drum head) you'll give your hands a chance to learn the basic moves a little better, which will give you a better foundation for playing bigger, if you choose to.

I'm talking just about practicing your basic technique-- actually playing music on the drums you have to do whatever the situation calls for.
 
When you play german grip, you might want to straighen your left wrist a bit and angle the stick inwards. I have been told that I do the same thing and that it's damaging, so that's something I'm working on too.

220px-Matched_Grip_Example.jpg


I also noticed the middle finger thing on your left hand. Maybe your middle fingers are quite relaxed on the stick because you're relying on your index finger, which might be squeezing a bit too tight (hence the pain).

You might have noticed I have asked for help on here too, and I have technique issues, so take this with a grain of salt
 
Sure, I hope that helps. Re: #3, if you do what you're doing on an actual snare drum, I think you'll hear what I mean-- you'll be hurting your ears, and not getting a very good tone. Plain old generic good modern snare drum technique (as I know it, anyway) is designed to operate in a zone of about 1"-14" stick heights. If you bring your heights down quite a bit, simplify your stroke, and maintain good form (wrists flat, sticks making a 90 deg piece of pie on the drum head) you'll give your hands a chance to learn the basic moves a little better, which will give you a better foundation for playing bigger, if you choose to.

I'm talking just about practicing your basic technique-- actually playing music on the drums you have to do whatever the situation calls for.

When you mention keeping your wrists flat, do you mean keeping the palms down so the wrists are parallel to the floor?

By the way, I seem to remember that when I started playing many years ago, I wore isolation headphones to protect my ears from the sound. Good idea, but very likely I got in the habit of playing harder so I could hear the drum sound better through the headphones.

I am on an E-kit now and am hesitant to turn the volume up too much, as I don't want to hurt my hearing. But that could lend me to playing too hard, for the same reason. Anyway this could just be an old habit.

When I feel the pain in my hand, it is carpal tunnel-like, i.e. feels like an inflamed or pinched nerve between my first two fingers, and thumb. Sometimes I feel like I "push" the stick against the surface too much, putting stress on that "triangle" fulcrum between those fingers. There appears to be a fine line between letting the stick do the work, and controlling the stick so it does what you want. Then again the position of the drums can affect this too, I'm finding. Do you have any tips on how to get the stress off of the fingers/thumb like that, other than what you mentioned already?
 
When you mention keeping your wrists flat, do you mean keeping the palms down so the wrists are parallel to the floor?

Right, basically palms down... the only time I switch to a thumbs-up grip is to play the ride cymbal.

By the way, I seem to remember that when I started playing many years ago, I wore isolation headphones to protect my ears from the sound. Good idea, but very likely I got in the habit of playing harder so I could hear the drum sound better through the headphones.

I am on an E-kit now and am hesitant to turn the volume up too much, as I don't want to hurt my hearing. But that could lend me to playing too hard, for the same reason. Anyway this could just be an old habit.

That's why I don't like those headphones, or near-silent practice pads-- they induce you to hit harder, and they remove tone production from the equation. Normally, the sound you're getting is the thing telling you how to hit the drum-- with those things, you have only this dim picture of what you would be doing sonically if you were playing/hearing an instrument, and all you have to work with is the physics.

And I'm really not fond of e-kits, either. Playing drums is normally a very straightforward thing that your nervous system understands instantly-- you touch the instrument, it emanates a sound. When you instead play on pieces of shaped rubber which make these pristine digital sounds come out of a speaker somewhere else, your body doesn't handle it that same way. Of course things are going to get weird on you-- I think that's what you're experiencing right now.

When I feel the pain in my hand, it is carpal tunnel-like, i.e. feels like an inflamed or pinched nerve between my first two fingers, and thumb. Sometimes I feel like I "push" the stick against the surface too much, putting stress on that "triangle" fulcrum between those fingers. There appears to be a fine line between letting the stick do the work, and controlling the stick so it does what you want. Then again the position of the drums can affect this too, I'm finding. Do you have any tips on how to get the stress off of the fingers/thumb like that, other than what you mentioned already?

Not really-- it would be best if you could get with a teacher. Again, not with the kind of "technique" guys you find teaching at Guitar Center, but with an actual professional musician.
 
I agree you need to work this out with a professional teacher. It seems to me, and I am no grip/stroke Dr., that you have issues with the orientation of your wrists and the angles of your forearms. Looks like a lot of stress on your thumb and therefor the muscle you mention.
 
What size sticks are you using here? They look really thick. It might not hurt to try using smaller sticks. I personally have a much more difficult time controlling really chunky sticks compared to something like a 5A. Bigger sticks also require a lot more work for your hands, which, along with less-than-ideal technique, could contribute to the pain you're experiencing.
 
It appears that the indexs aren't much involved in the fulcrum.

It sounds like your second hit on a double is weak. Try to do the opposite and get the second one louder then the 1st one to try something different.

Try to do your paradiddles without the accent on the downbeat. All strikes even.
When you can do that , then to singles to doubles to paradiddle and listen for all the strokes to be the same (no accent anywhere).
 
What size sticks are you using here? They look really thick. It might not hurt to try using smaller sticks. I personally have a much more difficult time controlling really chunky sticks compared to something like a 5A. Bigger sticks also require a lot more work for your hands, which, along with less-than-ideal technique, could contribute to the pain you're experiencing.

They're the Thomas Lang signature, and yes they are big. I used to use a smaller size, but the larger size seems to give me better control and are easier to hold. Similar to using a thick pen instead of a thin one.
 
Thanks for the feedback everyone. I'll give that a try. Initially I notice when taking the earlier suggestions (palms down, smaller strokes), I am feeling a "burning" in the muscle above my wrist. That is probably a good thing as I am likely working the muscles there instead of putting stress on my fingers.

I find I tend to hit the drum with my right hand pointed sideways, not down. Not sure why this is, I don't experience this with the left hand - maybe the drum feels too close and is hard to hit with the palm down. I'll play with it and see where it goes.
 
In response to your last post...in the first video it looked like your right wrist was touching your ribs (as if you were about to pat a full belly). If that is true, it would make german grip (wrists down) problematic at best. It is easier for the body to make your wrists do that if they are a tad farther out. If you keep your elbows about 6" away from your torso you can SEE your hands go palms down. Just something to look at. As to where your elbows should be when playing..I will let someone else chime in. I just noticed this for meself and thought I would share.
 
I'd like to get some feedback on my hand technique. The reason I ask is that I sometimes get pain in the area between the index finger and thumb, and it could be that I am overgripping or tightening up. I don't notice this in my left hand at all, just my right. So I am trying to determine if I really am playing okay or if there are any areas where I need to adjust my technique. Any tips? Thanks!

(Sorry if the video isn't very good or the hi hat stand is in the way. I had a hard time finding a good angle here.)

http://youtu.be/sdzQxgdmBOc

I'll tell you whats causing your pain, with out even looking at your technique, you're smacking those hard pads, like hitting concrete after a while. Not as bad as the wrist shattering Simmonds pads. Go on to youtube and see how hitting a drum makes your fingers look in Super Slow Motion... You'd be surprised how fingers react to forces. :)
 
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