Why?

If you play with the metronome instead of your bandmates, the feel of the music is lost. There's a certain push/pull in most music that makes it feel good, as well as a push/pull that occurs between the players, and playing with a metronome eliminates the possibility of that. Music stops "breathing", so to speak...

But, yeah...ask your bandmates. They should have their own answer.
 
I've played with a few acts that sequenced for backing vocals and I was the only one playing to the click. No problems as long as you're with the click.
 
If you play with the metronome instead of your bandmates, the feel of the music is lost. There's a certain push/pull in most music that makes it feel good, as well as a push/pull that occurs between the players, and playing with a metronome eliminates the possibility of that. Music stops "breathing", so to speak...

But, yeah...ask your bandmates. They should have their own answer.

It's funny how some musicians look at it this way, while others expect the drummer to be the perfect time keeper playing every note on a click. Honestly, I think it comes down to their musicianship. I've noticed that the better the players I'm playing with, the more likely they are to let the music breathe and play off each others ideas and push pull of the tempo. On the flip side, I've also played with guys who really can't handle anything but the drummer being a metronome for them to play to, instead of with.

Both approaches can certainly produce good music, though I think clicked stuff often ends up sounding a bit stale.

When I'm by myself, I bring out the clicks. When I'm with other people at band practice, or playing for other people, I never want to line up with a machine. I want feel. I bet this is what your band mates are getting at. You might take it as a compliment; I reckon they don't think you have trouble slowing/speeding during fills or transitions, and they want to gel a bit more with you.
 
I've met a few people who seem quite suspicious of a click. Never drummers, usually guitarists :) . They seem to have a romanticised vision of what playing music is, where everyone has some innate sense of rhythm and musicality and the sterile repetitive nature of a click is antithetical to "just feeling the music, man".

Needless to say their timing is usually not very good.
 
My guess is they want to leave the dirty work to you. You hear the click and keep with it, they just keep with you. That's how it usually works in a pro situation anyway right? Stringed instruments don't get a click as far as I know.
 
A lot of players don't like the click and that's fine. The guys in one of my bands don't like it either, but the other band uses it for everything.

If you're the one that wants to use it in your band, why not strike a compromise and use it sometimes and other times not? At our rehearsals, when we're running through the set before a show, we usually like to try and make it through it twice. The second time through the set is invariably better, and more relaxed, that the fist.

If that's how you guys do it, then try using the click the first run-thru, then turn it off for the second. Clicks are great for calibrating everyone's time, but you don't need to keep it on all the time either. And in their defense, while you want to have good meter and having a click to play to will definitely help with that, it does make for some rigid playing.

Having it off while playing solid time is a very worthy goal.
 
Would you guys agree the push-pull should be against a solid meter, like a click? How can you play behind the beat, for instance, if the beat is arbitrary? As for in rehearsals, in my opinion the band should learn their songs to a metronome at first, or you'll end up with a band that basically has one or two favorite tempos, and they play it all night.
 
Would you guys agree the push-pull should be against a solid meter, like a click? How can you play behind the beat, for instance, if the beat is arbitrary?

Yes.....couldn't agree more about the "solid meter" aspect.

Don't necessarily agree that, that solid meter must be determined by a click though.

As for in rehearsals, in my opinion the band should learn their songs to a metronome at first, or you'll end up with a band that basically has one or two favorite tempos, and they play it all night.

But isn't "solid meter" one of the fundamental aspects of drumming? If a drummer can't play to "reasonable" time, then he may as well take up guitar.

A met. it a tool...a valuable tool that a drummer can compare himself against in order to ensure he's on target. To make it a "crutch" that must be relied upon solely to "find" or "determine" a drummers' meter, kinda negates the purpose of it in the first instance (or at the very least, it should negate the need for you as a drummer in your own right).

I find the met invaluable as a practice aid........But, I'm not comfortable in letting it dictate the entire performance....unless you're relying on sequenced or programmed tracks....or....recording "blind" (i.e tracking drums with no other guide instruments)....in which case, it's more or less vital.
 
Would you guys agree the push-pull should be against a solid meter, like a click? How can you play behind the beat, for instance, if the beat is arbitrary?

The beat isn't arbitrary at all, it's simply human. Solid is not the same thing as machine perfect. Depends a lot on the type of music you play, and the players involved.

As for in rehearsals, in my opinion the band should learn their songs to a metronome at first, or you'll end up with a band that basically has one or two favorite tempos, and they play it all night.

I strive to be able to play all my songs at whatever tempo it gets counted in to. Sometimes we play them fast or slow on purpose, but in general, there's usually a speed at which the whole band grooves a song best, and I find we don't need a metronome to locate that speed usually. For the way we play our stuff, the metronome is generally used as a self-improvement tool. I practice regimented stuff and play to pre-clicked songs to develop a personal sense of consistent meter at any tempo. My goals in this relation are set by the energy-fueled blues/punk/rock stuff I'm into; if I played to sequenced stuff or super regimented note-perfect music, I'd be a lot more likely to insist on a click for band practice.
 
When I'm by myself, I bring out the clicks. When I'm with other people at band practice, or playing for other people, I never want to line up with a machine. I want feel. I bet this is what your band mates are getting at. You might take it as a compliment; I reckon they don't think you have trouble slowing/speeding during fills or transitions, and they want to gel a bit more with you.

I agree. I don't like using a click because it takes some of my attention from the band. Pros are confident with a click so they can devote almost all their attention to the band and the click is pretty well a backup.

It looks like the band isn't willing to sacrifice gelling with you while you're still learning to be totally comfortable with the click. It's only going to work if all the band is keen for you to use the click. No drama, as long as the music sounds good. After all, as accompanists we do whatever it takes to make the rest of the band feel comfortable.
 
I'm first and foremost a guitarplayer and I guess I'm sort of know for being picky on drummers.

It depends, but generally a metronome will inhibit a drummer from truly listening to and feeling the music. Further more, a metronome won't help make a groove work. The music and the vibe will show you where the pulse should be in any specific situaition.

Sometimes the gig requires a click for other reasons and that is fine, but a part of the music will then be influenced by more thinking where the emphasis should probably be more on feeling.

If you do use a click, remember that it is not the boss and is not an organic being with any sense of pulse or groove, it is just an indicator of steady mathematical time.

I've met so many drummers who think they got this down and gave even been almost brainwashed in school to think that metronomic time and groove is the same thing. For an experienced musician that is a drummer that it's hard to make truly good feeling music with. They are essentially too stuck in their heads.
 
Right, I get what you guys saying about the band/drummer should be able to groove without a click, but time is everyone's responsibility. If the drummer is using a click only when working out on the pad or while otherwise shedding, that won't necessarily help other musicians with their bad habits regarding time - unless you're Larry who can successfully refuse to budge!

I don't know how many muso's I've played with over the years that have avoided clicks like the plague (always using the "It'll make us sterile" argument) but then turn around and pull me all over the place and otherwise make things feel bad. That was the reason I started bringing my click to practice to begin with.

I'm not saying I want to use a click as a matter of course and I don't want to use them for shows or recording, or even at practice most of the time, but it seems to me that it helps the whole band understand where time really is, so if straying is desired, at least everyone knows where that wants to happen and by how much.

The practice room is really the only appropriate place to work on that.
 
Right, I get what you guys saying about the band/drummer should be able to groove without a click, but time is everyone's responsibility. If the drummer is using a click only when working out on the pad or while otherwise shedding, that won't necessarily help other musicians with their bad habits regarding time - unless you're Larry who can successfully refuse to budge!

I don't know how many muso's I've played with over the years that have avoided clicks like the plague (always using the "It'll make us sterile" argument) but then turn around and pull me all over the place and otherwise make things feel bad. That was the reason I started bringing my click to practice to begin with.

I'm not saying I want to use a click as a matter of course and I don't want to use them for shows or recording, or even at practice most of the time, but it seems to me that it helps the whole band understand where time really is, so if straying is desired, at least everyone knows where that wants to happen and by how much.

The practice room is really the only appropriate place to work on that.

Very good post. I seriously doubt the other instruments practice to a metronome the way drummers tend to. So rehearsing a song to the metronome will let the band feel the song where it should be, before they get into their "organic groove, feel" line of grief that drummers tend to hear from, usually, the person in the band with the worst time.

I'd like to hear from some of the pros here on where the click factors into rehearsals for major tours and such.
 
in one of my old bands we once tried putting just me on a metronome with headphones. the band had a tough time syncing with me because they were so used to being able to pull me along with them. maybe your band is like that too. when they're forced to play exactly the tempo the drummer is setting it makes them uncomfortable or they have a hard time doing it.
 
in one of my old bands we once tried putting just me on a metronome with headphones. the band had a tough time syncing with me because they were so used to being able to pull me along with them. maybe your band is like that too. when they're forced to play exactly the tempo the drummer is setting it makes them uncomfortable or they have a hard time doing it.

This is exactly the case with one of the bands I play with now. They were so used to playing with a drummer that had mediocre time and that followed as much as he led when it came to holding down tempos. A year ago they struggled keeping a solid groove with me if I didn't adjust to their shifts.

The other band I play with were very comfortable with playing along to the rhythm section and I haven't had any of the aforementioned issues.

I introduced a click to our practice sessions and it went miserably. The were very reluctant to give up the push/pull (which I never suggested we get rid of) and there was a lot of struggling to get the same feel while hearing the click.

I just go with the flow and on certain songs, I adjust and on others I just stay there and let them find their way back.

So, long story short, I would keep the click (in your ears only) if you need it. Another way to make strides with this issue in practice sessions, is to start a jam with drums and bass and have everyone else jump in. Over time they will get more comfortable with listening and following the tempo.
 
Because metronomed music sucks, and I'm not alone. I still find it amazing that drummers are willing and often times want to give up that part of what makes them useful in a band. Might as well be practicing to a drum machine. (Yes, some bands actually do that ;/)
 
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