Focusing on finger control or wrist control?

C

cantstoplt021

Senior Member
I thought that one thing I needed to work on big time was finger control.. I'm relatively new to drumming and I'm really trying to work on my stick technique (as well as independence) because it's the main thing holding me back. I play traditional and I noticed that my fingers do very little when I'm playing faster things. It's mostly just wrists which I don't think is the correct way to do things. With my right hand I have some control over the fingers, but with my traditional hand there has been very little. I mostly just lock the fingers and use my wrist. Now I don't think that's correct. It seems to me that since the fingers are directly in contact with the stick they are probably pretty important in terms of control.

I saw some other threads where people were saying to just focus on wrist control and that finger control will just come naturally. Is this true? Should I just focusing on getting my wrists up to speed and then worry about fingers or the other way around? I'd like to be able to play fast, but I would also like to have good control over the stick.

Oh and I can only play singles at about 125 bpm cleanly without tiring out or sounding uneven. Pretty slow I'd say.
 
You and I are in a similar boat. The bits of advice I am qualified to give are:

Schedule some time with a professional teacher that can evaluate, correct, and steer you in the right direction. It only needs to be a 30m to 1h session. It only needs to be once every one or two months.

Practice on a variety of surfaces, ranging from pillow-soft and ending with cranked snare tension. Soft surfaces force you to develop good technique as you're having to get the tip away from the surface.

Work on your double stroke roll. You need a strong double stroke roll with good even notes for any of the other rudiments to come together. BillB and others have a wealth of videos on how to get this going.
 
As a beginner you should ONLY follow the advice of a trusted, real drumming professional. Technique discussions between less advanced players often cause more problems than solve anything.

Find a good teacher, or get Skype lessons from someone like Bill Bachman, or do drumworkout.com.

It all starts with the free stroke.
 
Like Jeff said - it all starts with the Freestroke. Find a teacher that really understands that concept and you’ll have a great foundation. As a beginner, also check out matched grip.
 
I have a teacher who is a very good working drummer. He's toured with people, plays with lots of pro jazz musicians, studied for years with a guy that toured with Albert King and Chuck Berry among others. He's a good teacher. Problem is he doesn't play traditional grip at all. Not sure how much he knows about the grip, but I'll ask him about the free stroke when I see him next. I would play more matched the problem is it hurts my wrist when I play it no matter how relaxed I am. It's why I switched to traditional.
 
I just looked into the free stroke and boom there's my problem. With my right hand (matched hand) I allow it to rebound although it could be a little better it still rebounds. My left hand however (traditional grip) wasn't rebounding at all. I was gripping the stick wrong in a way that didn't allow it to bounce, which wastes a lot of energy and generates too much tension. I'm going to focus on getting my left hand to rebound. I've been doing exercises where I bounce the stick using my fulcrum, index, middle, index and middle fingers and I can play so much faster and even with much less tension. I just have to do it enough so that it's natural and I don't revert back to my old way when I'm actually playing. I suspect this will fix a lot of issues for me.
 
your left hand hurts, did you have an accident ?

You dont really need fingers till 170-176 bpm. (Eight notes)

My advice is to focus on

A) Focus on learning how to hold the sticks correctly and developing a fulcrum.

B) Learning how to turn the wrist correctly

C) later you add fingers

Check out also the Murray Spivack method if it works for you.
 
How new are we talking?

lessons are good way to start and learn good technique. but don't expect to be doing 16th notes at 200 bpm over night.


the trick is to play to a click as fast as you can while being relaxed... if your tensing up you need to practice more... drumming shouldn't be painful either.

its true what they say though. time and practice.
 
I agree that seeing a professional when you're first starting is very important. But a lot of drummers are self taught, I think if you absorb what knowledge you can and experiment, you can decide for yourself.
I'd say focus on your fingers since, in my opinion, that is the least natural. But in general try to get your wrists and fingers to work together. I find that both working together is better than one or the other. "All wrist" has maximum power and control but puts a lot of stress on your hands when playing fast. "All fingers" takes out a lot of control and power. So if you work both individually, to build them individually, and then use them together and find your sweet spot, you'll find your own way.
 
Forgive me, but it sort of sounds like your insistence on trad grip is holding you back a bit here. Are you doing it because someone you like does, or are you mostly into jazz? I'm not saying you're doing so, but I've seen some people insist on trad because their favorite drummer does it, when really that person would be better served just playing matched and not having the extra challenge right off the bat.
 
I'm not a complete beginner. I've been playing for about 6 months probably and I can keep steady time, and I'm "good enough" to play drums at blues jams and not make a fool of myself.

I would think that fingers would give you the most control on the stick since they are the thing actually in contact with it.

And I'm learning traditional for a few reasons, a bunch of my favorite drummers play it, it looks cool, it feels more natural since I play guitar and traditional grip and holding the guitar neck feel similar and most importantly matched grip starts to really hurt my wrist pretty quickly when I use it. No matter how loose I am it still really hurts.
 
cantstoplt021 said:
I'm not a complete beginner. I've been playing for about 6 months probably and I can keep steady time, and I'm "good enough" to play drums at blues jams and not make a fool of myself.
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6 months is still beginner category. It typically takes a least a few years to really be able to express yourself, but it depends on a lot of things. This isn't a dig, I just don't want you to feel that you should have already gotten these things down. It took most of us longer than that for sure.

I would think that fingers would give you the most control on the stick since they are the thing actually in contact with it.
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"most control" isn't really the idea. The arm, wrist, fingers and all associated muscles should all be working together depending on what exactly you're doing.

And I'm learning traditional for a few reasons, a bunch of my favorite drummers play it, it looks cool,
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While it may look cool, it's also more difficult to get right and make feel good. It's very nuanced and unless you're really doing it correct through and through, it will hold you back. Frankly, everyone has trouble with their off-hand being out-paced by their dominant hand. A beginner with no teacher trying to self learn a very un-natural grip is going to have some trouble.
it feels more natural since I play guitar and traditional grip and holding the guitar neck feel similar
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Well, as far as natural goes, it's about as natural as a golf swing. Which is to say, it's not natural. Give a child who has never played before some sticks. Take a guess how he's going to hold them, then re-think that "natural" thing. It's a tradition built upon a foundation that no-longer exists. We don't use slanted drums in slings anymore. Nobody knowledgeable that I've seen has ever stated that trad is the more natural way to hold a stick.
and most importantly matched grip starts to really hurt my wrist pretty quickly when I use it. No matter how loose I am it still really hurts.
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This could be an injury, or it could be bad technique, or bad kit setup. All roads here are leading towards taking a few basic technique and grip lessons with a professional teacher. Don't hurt yourself, and don't self-develop bad habits or technique that you'll have to fix later.

Anyhoo, I'm not trying to be argumentative. Each person should use the grip and technique that makes them play the best they can. The end result is what really matters, and based on your own words above, you're already able to exercise some finger control in your normal grip, but not in trad. Just make sure you're doing it for the right reasons, and the right reason is musical expression.
 
Let me just rephrase what I said. You asked what you should focus on more, fingers or wrist. I said fingers because it's less natural and harder to develope compared to wrist (imo). Basically I said work on your weak side, but focus on both (wrist and fingers) as a whole. As far as what technique and how to do it "correctly" you're going to have to experiment to see what's best for you. Literally thousands of drummers play French grip, while I purposely don't because it's uncomfortable and is said to develope carpal tunnel. That might be completely different for you. You said matched grip hurts, chances are you're doing it incorrectly. Like Watso said, you're drum set might be set up in a bad way. Also, 6 months is definitely beginner, not to be mean but it's my opinion (I generally go 50/50 Years playing : What you can play) So like I said, take a lesson or two, take notes, and build a core foundation for your technique. It will save you A LOT of time and won't risk damaging your wrist's...trust me
 
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