Drum sound on the new Rush album...

As a long time Neil/Rush fan, am I alone in finding the drum sound on the latest Rush album slightly disappointing?

To me, as well as the drums being down in the mix, some of the tom fills sound muddy and indistinct, while the ride cymbal doesn't sound integrated with the rest of the kit. It sounds like a separate instrument.

Learning from early 80s Rush albums as a young drummer was a breeze as the drum sound was so clear and up in the mix.

This album for me, sonically, is a step backward, despite all the advances in digital recording.

Some strong material though, nevertheless!

I too really miss the days with Terry Brown was producing and mixing for them.

There's a new Rush album? Wow.

i like the sound treatment of the single. A lot of grunt production's gone into that, but I'm not getting the same depth of drive in the sounds on some of the other tracks I've heard. The drums are compressed to hell & back. In some tracks that delivers, especially when the bass guitar is growling, but in others, it renders the drums a bit thin & short for my taste. Neil's early drum sound, in isolation, was truly dreadful, but that was deliberate, & in the context of those songs, especially for the era, it worked beautifully. In this album, I especially like the way the cymbals sit low in the mix. That works for me, it's just a pity that the cymbal sounds are fairly poor & one dimensional. Personally, I'd prefer the use of very dry cymbals in that setting, & lifted in level to compensate. They'd still sit in the mix, but in a much more flavoursome way. I'd be impressed if Neil allowed his drums to open up sometimes. His DW's are naturally thumpy anyhow, & that's compounded by compression. I'm assuming they've gone for impact definition. Again, that works on some tracks, but not others. Overall, I think it's the best Rush album for many years.

Yes, I just listened to this CD in my car all the way through. Meh.
I too miss the days of Terry Brown. It seems that each one of the last 6 or so albums , I have heard a lot of talk about how they are going back to their roots, back to basics, re-inventng , etc etc. Yawn.
I lost interest in Rush back around the Hold your Fire album, and I don't hear anything here luring me back or worth a second listen.
Disappointing.

Neal

Bring back the older Tama and Ludwig,then stop compressing the crap out of everything.This idea of finding perfection in everything,including drum sound, consistantly falls short of the mark.Lets get back to a more organic,live sounding recording.

Steve B

tamadrm said:

Bring back the older Tama and Ludwig,thant stop compressing the crap out of everything.This idea of finding perfection in everything,including drum sound, consistantly falls short of the mark.Lets get back to a more organic,live sounding recording.

Steve B

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Indeed, I am tiring on drums not sounding like drums on quiet a bit of modern music. That is part of the reason I love live albums. There are some dubs/effects in some live albums too, but at least they get a real live sound to instruments, esp. drums.

tamadrm said:

Bring back the older Tama and Ludwig,thant stop compressing the crap out of everything.This idea of finding perfection in everything,including drum sound, consistantly falls short of the mark.Lets get back to a more organic,live sounding recording.

Steve B

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Yeah, I'm up for that Steve, as I mentioned in my post below. Someone of international repute needs to break the mould in popular music. Perhaps that would then encourage the lemmings of the record industry look for another cliff to jump off.

The drums were pretty badly mixed, but not nearly as bad as Evanescence newest CD. That just made me wanna cry. Live albums were mentioned and I agree, also I like demo albums' sound too.

keep it simple said:

Overall, I think it's the best Rush album for many years.

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Despite how disappointed I am with the drum sound and the album in general I agree with you, I think it's their best effort in a long time. I bet this would sound better live, as other have stated.

I was trying to put my finger on what I find is off about this album in general...it's as if they are all overplaying without really playing anything. Nothing very memorable I guess.

Neal

Milt Hathaway said:

I too really miss the days with Terry Brown was producing and mixing for them.

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I agree 100%. It's all about the producer. Terry did justice to their material. Take the drums on Tom Sawyer or anything off of Moving Pictures LP. It was right there, alive, vibrant, inspiring millions of would-be drummers. Rascieiwcz or whomever they have now is the wrong person. His sound is compressed, muddled, too digital.

It amazes me that the producer and record label know Peart is regarded as a drumming god, and he "is" Rush, really. Nothing against the genious of the other two but Neil brought the band it's worldwide status.

The real shame here is,with just a little imagination you can almost hear what the album would have sounded like with that raw,organic lets play it live in the studio sound.These guys are top shelf players,so just get some good mic placement,and let er' rip.

THAT is something the listening public,and fellow musicians,and maybe a few producers with their head out of their ass,will take notice of."Wow ....what a new fresh and original concept".I can see the reviews in Rolling Stone now(talk about heads up asses).

Hey Neil.....I'm not your biggest fan,but you guys don't need the sonic equlivent of photo shop.Just give us some honest rock and roll,and the rest will take care of itself.



Steve B

While the new album won't go in history as one of their best, it is the best album they've released in a long time.

As for as sonically, at least as far as the drums are concerned, I think it's rather raw. The drums sound like Neil's tone live (even I often wonder why he prefers to crank the heads on his DWs). It is a different tone than the one Neil used to have, but it's been this way for a while now.

Compared to most modern records, there is no quantization, no triggering, no sound replacement software. Heck, you can even hear Neil clicking his sticks in some spots.

The final mix is highly compressed, and digital sounding, but that's modern production for you.

The only think that perhaps takes away from the drum tone is the guitar is mixed rather wet, which is stepping on some of the same frequencies of the drums.

But I will say I think their working with Nick Raskulinecz is over hyped. He really ruined the last Rush album for me, so I was a bit disappointed that they brought him back for this. But thank god he didn't double track all vocals this time around.

supermac said:

As a long time Neil/Rush fan, am I alone in finding the drum sound on the latest Rush album slightly disappointing?

To me, as well as the drums being down in the mix, some of the tom fills sound muddy and indistinct, while the ride cymbal doesn't sound integrated with the rest of the kit. It sounds like a separate instrument.

Click to expand...

I've only given it a few plays, but...I found the drum sounds to be processed, , compressed, unnatural and lacking in any distinctive personality. A product of the source (DW) which is MOR / vanilla.

Makes me long for the days of analog / Ludwig or Tama or even Slingerland.

Some of the material reminds me of the track Peaceable Kingdom - the production on that was decent.

I would have enjoyed hearing someone like Bob Ezrin or Terry Brown produce a Rush album - this one would have been perfect for that.

There is something about Geddy's vocal delivery that bugs me. The melodies just sound random to me. Live, he just sounds terrible sometimes these days. I have an audio producer friend who thinks that Geddy has lost a lot of his hearing, based on the way he sings. Most Rush fans excuse him of it- myself included. I am just glad they are still touring. But the vocals are the weak link by far.

Alex seems to love these jangly repetitive riffs these days. It's okay- but I keep waiting for the buzz I got from their older stuff. A lot of songs from Snakes and Arrows I really liked, but these riffs don't stand the test of time very well. They just get a little boring. It's like looking at a painting where I can appreciate the craftsmanship but it doesn't inspire me very much.

Hate to be negative. I really like "Clockwork Angels" and "Seven Cities of Gold." Some very well written choruses. But I find myself searching around on the CD for stuff that has some punch. Maybe it will grow on me in time.

Just got the cd and have only listened to it through a couple of times. None of the songs really jump out at me as being "great". Funny, this morning I was listening to it and and found myself becoming annoyed with the overall sound but just couldn't put my finger on what it was that bugged me.
I agree that it would probably sound better live.

Just heard it. The drums are WAY over-compressed. I agree, there's no "life" to them at all.


The over-all sound also seems to be more of a "sonic soundscape/jammy" sorta thing than actual compositions. Then again, I never considered that band especially melodic. Moving Pictures has their best songs. And there's a smattering of good songs throughout their entire catalogue, but they're few and far between. IMO