Drum machines have no soul?

randomizer

Junior Member
Could I ak all musicians what is your view/opinions on the comment "Drum Machines Have no Soul"?

also possibly your views on the introduction of technology into the music industry; drum machines used instead of drummers, keyboards used instead of strings, woodwind and brass.

thanks
 
Drum Machines are an instrument just like anything else. In the right hands it can have a life of it's own. Listen to Dr. Dre, DJ Premier, Timbaland.
 
Didn't this arguement/discussion start sometime back in the mid to late 70's. Still, plenty of musicians found work over the last 30 years. And cats like Chris Vrenna, Ken Wilson (Ginger Fish) and Matt Walker land gigs because they can play drums and program like monsters. Certain types will always need "a sound". whether it be acoustic or electronic. And with more triggers being used in "studio and live" applications, the middle ground becomes "less defined" all the time.
 
Could I ak all musicians what is your view/opinions on the comment "Drum Machines Have no Soul"?

also possibly your views on the introduction of technology into the music industry; drum machines used instead of drummers, keyboards used instead of strings, woodwind and brass.

thanks

Why don't you tell us what you think?

I think they do sound mechanistic and soulless, at least compared to actual humans playing physical instruments. But there are a lot of genres for where that is desirable (techno, rave, etc.) because all the other instruments are electronic as well.

Aphex Twin does a good job of revealing the "soul" of electronic instruments. Machines are such a part of music now that they have their own aesthetic and soul to explore.
 
Good question, and I'll share my thoughts.

The reason drum machines lack soul ( besides not having one to start with ) is because time/ and tempo are not exact sciences.

I find all this forum talk about metronomes and clicks interesting because while they are invaluable tools for practice and recordings, having a super- quantized drum track bang in the middle, dead center, almost always sounds sterile and souless. And while we aspire to fulfill our roles as good time-keepers to the music world, we need to aim a bit beyond just keeping good time.

You could be playing in time but sitting on top of the beat or be so behind it, it is a vast space that we inarticulatelly call 'feel'.

And that really comes from the drummer reacting to how he is feeling the music. Which is not easy for drum machines to do.

Music editing programs have quantization settings where you could swing the 8ths , 16ths, 32nds whatever to make the track sound more 'human'. It never quite does it , IMO.

I guess to be human is to be imperfect. And drum machines are perfect.

Thats a contradiction in terms.

Electronica,Trance, D n B , yes thats another world,, with its own rites & rituals.. using patterns of perfection to create imperfections
 
I like Drum Machines. They have a certain style that is very hard to copy for a human drummer. As with most technologies, put to creative (rather than to replace a real drummer) use they can be just as legitimate and indeed 'soulful' as a real drummer. Listen to early NIN recordings, 'Pretty Hate Machine' wouldn't be the same without the drum machines. Some of the Radiohead tracks from the electronic years wouldn't be the same. Imagine the beginning of Idioteque with Phil Selway on the drums? No thanks, I'd rather have the machine, I just think it suits the music better on that example.

Drum Machines, Synthesisers etc, are very rarely used to replace 'real' instruments (with the possible exception of strings) because simply put, they do NOT sound the same. They're being put to an entirely creative use as a different sound rather than to replace the human in the equation. String patches are an exception of convenience because recording a string section is beyond the realms of most home studios.

That begs the question of Electronic Drums. They're half-way between Drum Machines and Acoustic Drums; the sound (often) of the Drum Machine with a human playing them. Where do they lie? Somewhere in between. There is a possibiilty with everything to find a creative use.
 
There's a good few human drummers who don't seem to have any soul either.
 
The reason for my post is that I am writing a thesis on technology in the music industry. I want to investigate the impact it is having on musicians these days; whether they are for or against it.

I aim it at drummers in particular just because I came accross John Wood's bumper sticker campaign "Drum Machines Have no Soul"
 
i have a playlist on my iTunes that i labled "Play Along" and basically whenever a good groove comes up on random shuffle, i copy that track to the "Play Along" playlist. i think over half the tunes are technically programed drums, but the grooves still move me. recent additions have been "Heaven's Gonna Burn Your Eyes" by Theivery Corporation, and "Protection" by Massive Attack. most of the best hip-hop grooves are drum machines (excepting mr. ?estlove of course).

the thing i find ironic is that a drum machine could technically play something extremely complex and unplayable by a human, but where drum machines really excel is playing something extremely simple but very consistently. i think of tunes like "No DIggity" by Blackstreet, or "Bam Bam" by Chaka Demus and Pliers and how its basically the exact same 4 bar phrase repeated. how it really gets people moving on the dance floor and leaves room for the vocals to be heard with soul.

one could argue that drum machines have no soul, but they also have no ego, the absence of which truly allows the soul to shine through....
 
I remember back in the day when drum machines first came out myself and many other pro got nervous for a bit thinking Oh sh-----t I'm gong to be out of work. Well it never happened. Drum machines are an asset to a drummer for programming reasons and plus today with logic and garage band jam packs some of the grooves and percussion ensembles are freaking awesome. When I produce I really dig using a drum machine on some parts then bringing in the live drums to really kick it in the a----.
I welcome the technology but drummers have way more soul than drum machines will ever have. I would take a live drummer on a recording any day other than a loop or drum machine. Now combined is cool like I said but real drummers are whats up.,

Joe
 
But think about it. Is the introduction of technology eliminating the need for performers thus taking the emotion away from music. I mean, when I listen to clubbing music I sure don't feel the emotion associated with the lyrics.

Technology is allowing ameteurs more access to the industy and clouding the true skill and talents of any rising virtuoso.
 
This Bumper Sticker movement always cracks me up. I remember reading the article about the old jazz pianoman who thought drum machines and high tech gear are killing music. This guy even thinks muti track recording is bad. Please, get with the times already. Someone remind him his piano does'nt have a soul. It's just a box filled with strings and hammers.

Things like Samplers, Sequencers, Autotuners, EZdrummer plugins & lip syncing pop stars are just the way things are these days. Sure i think the lip syncing is all sorts of wrong. But i dont buy those records.

Technology is allowing ameteurs more access to the industy and clouding the true skill and talents of any rising virtuoso.

Well i have to say there arent many true virtuosos in the music industry. most peeps in the music biz are "good enough for rock and roll". If they make great music with alot of heart. I'm totally cool with that.

No matter how many high tech things are invented, you need someone with the skills to work it. there will never be a machine that creates music... Well at least not in our lifetime.
 
I think technology is being misused at the moment. It always is, until people realise what they're doing and calm down. Think about the way plate reverbs and slapback delay were used in the 50s, and digital reverb in the 80s. Things tend to balance out eventually. I think we're in a transitional phase.
 
I prefer music played by humans...though there is some w/ drum machines that I do like. I *still* think that music would be more enjoyable w/ a human at least playing the groove and maybe adding f/x w/ a machine, as an accompaniment.

Drum machines will never replace drummers. Drum machines cannot improvise and cannot create (yet) - humans can. When the day comes that they can...grab your laser cannon, join John Connor, and fight!
 
But think about it. Is the introduction of technology eliminating the need for performers thus taking the emotion away from music. I mean, when I listen to clubbing music I sure don't feel the emotion associated with the lyrics.

Technology is allowing ameteurs more access to the industy and clouding the true skill and talents of any rising virtuoso.

Try and tell me DJ Shadow and Aphex Twin aren't virtuosos.
 
I'm a little late to this dance but I have an opinion nonetheless and that opinion is that I dislike drum machines with a passion. When I was in Germany in the early 90's I was talking with another drummer and to this day what he told me still sticks in my head. He said drum machines only go up and down while real drummers have some swig and swag in their playing. He used his hand to show a rubbery side to side motion. I have yet to hear a better explanation than that.

Drum machines are stiff and mechanical have have none of the human elements I hear in human drummers. There is no elasticity with drum machines, just very rigid, mechanical sounds. Not my cup of tea. I have a recording of a fairly well known guitarist that recorded a version of Rush's La Villa Strangiato using a drum machine and I think it's disgraceful.
It's flat out mickey mouse and amateurish. He could't find a real drummer to play that piece? It's not exactly one of Peart's more difficult pieces.

I grew up listening to guys like Ian Paice, Carl Palmer, Don Brewer, Lenny White, Steve Gadd, etc. Drum machines have no place in my life nor the music I choose to listen to. They don't work for me and I make no apologies about that. Listen to the sweet little nuances in Harvey Mason's playing on Herbie Hancock's track, Chameleon. Drums machines can replicate that feel. Case closed!
 
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